27 replies to this topic

[angeleyeskkhr]

So. I just heard on the news that a local elementary school is instituting a new policy: If a child is tardy 4 or more times in one six week grading period, the child will only get pb&j sandwiches (and I think they said they won't allow outside food for the kid), no matter how much money they have on their lunch account. This just seems WRONG to me. Too many variables. What if the kid is allergic? If they are tardy, they probably aren't eating breakfast either, so just one small sandwich seems like you'd be setting them up for failure by not giving enough food to sate their hunger. And I'll be damned if you don't allow my kid to use her lunch money for freaking lunch OR let her eat a sack lunch I gave her.

Granted, she hasn't been tardy that many times before. But still.

[twizzle]

So. I just heard on the news that a local elementary school is instituting a new policy: If a child is tardy 4 or more times in one six week grading period, the child will only get pb&j sandwiches (and I think they said they won't allow outside food for the kid), no matter how much money they have on their lunch account. This just seems WRONG to me. Too many variables. What if the kid is allergic? If they are tardy, they probably aren't eating breakfast either, so just one small sandwich seems like you'd be setting them up for failure by not giving enough food to sate their hunger. And I'll be damned if you don't allow my kid to use her lunch money for freaking lunch OR let her eat a sack lunch I gave her.

Granted, she hasn't been tardy that many times before. But still.

Well, if it did say they won't allow kids to bring in their own lunches, that's odd. But you're not sure, so? And I can't imagine a school forcing an allergic child to eat a sandwich?

In our elementary schools they have the same policy and it's gone fine. If you come in too late, after hot lunch choices are tallied, you get a bag lunch (a sandwich and piece of fruit) instead of hot lunch. Too many kids were late, causing hot lunches (or more specifically, the amts and types of what's to be prepared) to be off. There wasn't enough hot lunches, esp for the all kids who hadn't been late, that wanted them. This corrected that issue.

I've no idea if that's why this district is implementing that policy, but it's why ours did, and like I said, it solved the issue of hot lunch shortages. They also implemented others to address the tardiness issues, but this one was mainly to fix the problems caused by so many kids being late.

Edited by twizzle, 05 March 2012 - 09:54 AM.

[butterflywings]

I guess it depends on how late the kids are. Are they coming in at 9:05 or 10am? I don't understand why they are punishing the kids (if you call PB&J punishment) when it's the parent's fault they are late. And how can they ban kids bringing their own food? No school is going to dictate what lunch my child eats.

We've been tardy a few times, not a lot, maybe 3 or 4 over this entire year. 1 of those times was for a dental appointment. We live the farthest from that school than any other family. That's a fact. In fact, the house to our left goes to another school district. I know being further away is no excuse, and that it was our choice to take her to this farther away elementary school, but when it played out in day to day life in the beginning of the year it sometimes got messy. The school says 9-3:15, but even if we got there at 8:50 everyone is already in their classes quietly working because the buses get them there at 8:35-8:40. We were getting her on time, but it looked like we were late, and it interrupted, I think, the flow of things for the class when dd walked in. We finally just gave up and started taking her there at 8:40 to get there at the same time as her classmates. We should have done that from day one but whatever.

This primarily affects parents who drive their kids to school. You know, the ones paying for their kids' transportation costs, and not relying on the school's budget to do it.

Edited by butterflywings, 05 March 2012 - 09:56 AM.

[angeleyeskkhr]

They don't tally lunches here. It is offered/available to all.

ETA: if this school is like DD's, they start at 7:45. Otherwise, they start at 8:00 an. So, more likely than not, someone starting at 7:46 (or 8:01) they are considered tardy and that is being generous i think at DD's school, the first bell rings at 7:36 and the tardy bell rings a bit before 7:45. Last six weeks DD had 3 due to that stupidness (I think 7:45 is way too early to start school).

ETA2: I did specifically hear that this rule is to address the TARDy issue and nothing else. I just don't see how it will address that issue.

Edited by angeleyeskkhr, 05 March 2012 - 10:44 AM.

[cljohnr]

They can't really directly punish the parents, who are ultimately responsible for a chronically tardy child. This could indirectly pressure those parents to do better. That's all I can think of. Of course, my stepdaughter would eat pb&j sandwiches for lunch every single day if the school allowed it, so it wouldn't be much of a deterrent for her.

This the school?
http://www.kristv.co...-as-punishment/

[Nemeweh]

[orangecrush]

My kid would eat whatever I sent for her lunch. If I don't send her PB&J sandwiches, then she won't be getting that for lunch.

I also think that I wouldn't even say anything to them, if they tried this with my kid. I would just contact an attorney and make it ugly from the get go.

[Battle_of_Evermore]

They don't tally lunches here. It is offered/available to all.

ETA: if this school is like DD's, they start at 7:45. Otherwise, they start at 8:00 an. So, more likely than not, someone starting at 7:46 (or 8:01) they are considered tardy and that is being generous i think at DD's school, the first bell rings at 7:36 and the tardy bell rings a bit before 7:45. Last six weeks DD had 3 due to that stupidness (I think 7:45 is way too early to start school).

ETA2: I did specifically hear that this rule is to address the TARDy issue and nothing else. I just don't see how it will address that issue.

My sister and I started school at 7:20 every morning.

[angeleyeskkhr]

Yeah. That is it. I didn't realize it was fifth an sixth graders. But I'm with OC. My kid would eat what I damn well have her.

[Tigz]

Then again......

If the kids know to look up the menu for that day....they will know which days to be tardy.

Just say'n

The school may find they have a lot of tardy kids on brussels sprout day.

[angeleyeskkhr]

Tigz. It doesn't work like that. If I'm reading this right, once they hit 4 tardies, they get sandwiches for the rest of the grading period (6 weeks). I may be reading it wrong, but that was my understanding.

Edited by angeleyeskkhr, 05 March 2012 - 02:36 PM.

[Bad Doctor Frost]

What does it accomplish? Control. It's one more way for the failed public school system to control a losing battle. It just seems silly, and you're right...what will it accomplish in the long run? I mean, how many children of that age are actually responsible for getting themselves to school? I'm going to assume not many. So, why not punish the kid because the parent, bus driver, etc... couldn't get them there on time, right? It makes perfect sense.

EDIT: I guess the older kids would be more responsible about getting to school on time, but K-4th or so...mot so much.

Edited by Bad Doctor Frost, 05 March 2012 - 02:39 PM.

[Nemeweh]

What does it accomplish? Control. It's one more way for the failed public school system to control a losing battle. It just seems silly, and you're right...what will it accomplish in the long run? I mean, how many children of that age are actually responsible for getting themselves to school? I'm going to assume not many. So, why not punish the kid because the parent, bus driver, etc... couldn't get them there on time, right? It makes perfect sense.

EDIT: I guess the older kids would be more responsible about getting to school on time, but K-4th or so...mot so much.

Oh dear lord in heaven...


I agree with what Frosty said (and yes I did feel a little dirty inside when I typed it.)

[angeleyeskkhr]

I don't think it would control much honestly because I for one wouldn't accept them not allowing my child to eat what I give them.

[Bad Doctor Frost]

What does it accomplish? Control. It's one more way for the failed public school system to control a losing battle. It just seems silly, and you're right...what will it accomplish in the long run? I mean, how many children of that age are actually responsible for getting themselves to school? I'm going to assume not many. So, why not punish the kid because the parent, bus driver, etc... couldn't get them there on time, right? It makes perfect sense.

EDIT: I guess the older kids would be more responsible about getting to school on time, but K-4th or so...mot so much.

Oh dear lord in heaven...


I agree with what Frosty said (and yes I did feel a little dirty inside when I typed it.)

I believe it was AutoBodyChick who told me on FB once that I was just saying what everyone else was scared to. I tend to do that. It's OK, you can join me in the Club of All Things Right, we have cookies

[baby duck]

What does it accomplish? Control. It's one more way for the failed public school system to control a losing battle. It just seems silly, and you're right...what will it accomplish in the long run? I mean, how many children of that age are actually responsible for getting themselves to school? I'm going to assume not many. So, why not punish the kid because the parent, bus driver, etc... couldn't get them there on time, right? It makes perfect sense.

EDIT: I guess the older kids would be more responsible about getting to school on time, but K-4th or so...mot so much.

Students in our district aren't counted tardy if the bus is late.

[luckydriver]

In our elementary schools they have the same policy and it's gone fine. If you come in too late, after hot lunch choices are tallied, you get a bag lunch (a sandwich and piece of fruit) instead of hot lunch. Too many kids were late, causing hot lunches (or more specifically, the amts and types of what's to be prepared) to be off. There wasn't enough hot lunches, esp for the all kids who hadn't been late, that wanted them. This corrected that issue.

I've no idea if that's why this district is implementing that policy, but it's why ours did, and like I said, it solved the issue of hot lunch shortages. They also implemented others to address the tardiness issues, but this one was mainly to fix the problems caused by so many kids being late.

it's been a very long time and i may misremember, but i dont remember a 'tally' taken of what i wanted to eat at lunch...or am i just forgetful and it's that way in all elementary schools and been so forever?

regarding the OP it seems like they handle the wording of this wrong. it sounds more like punishment than logistical issues how it's written

[SplashMom]

I am a nurse in a public elementary school. We start school each day at 7:40 and dismiss at 2:40. The first bell rings at 7:30, the tardy bell rings at 7:40. Our buses arrive early enough each morning so that the children who want breakfast can stop in the cafeteria and eat (most who eat breakfast are on free/reduced meal plan). Students who do not eat breakfast at school go to the commons area to read and wait for their teachers to pick them up and take them to class. The only time in the twelve years I've been there that I can remember a bus being late is when one broke down on the way to school. Many of our students are car riders. If their parents drop them off at 7:40 or after, they must come in to the school and sign the student in late. If they do not come in with their child when dropping them off late, our school secretary calls them on their cell phone and requests they come back to sign them in. At my school, it seems to be the same people day in and day out that drag their kids to school late. It's tiresome and it's disruptive to the class. We remind those parents that a school bus is available to pick their child up and get them to school on time, yet they insist upon bringing them because "the bus is too early". I am never late to work. I know I'm expected to be there at a certain time and I make sure I'm there. Although I don't agree with punishing a child for being tardy by withholding a hot lunch and offering pb&j only, I do believe some consequences are necessary; otherwise, why wouldn't everyone just drag in whenever they like? Our students are not punished for being tardy but, after so many tardies, letters are sent to the parents from the superintendent. In the middle school, once a student is tardy a certain number of times, they serve lunch detention (eat lunch in ISS room). Additional tardies will land you in Saturday school. There is no excuse for chronic tardiness. We encourage parents to come for lunch with their children but we do not allow them to bring fast food. They can either bring a sack lunch or purchase lunch in the cafeteria. If a parent is hell-bent on bringing fast food, they can sign their child out for lunch and go to their car or the park for lunch.

[mdw2006]

Funny I saw this today Angel.

dd told me today (she is 9th) and she has been struggling in school the last year (some of it is are fault we where not keeping an eye on things as we should have, just been in a depression) but anyway, she is failing Art, I know it is Art but she is concreting on her core classes and making sure those have passing grades, she needs those to go on to high school, Art can be made up.

The Art teacher told the vice principal (interesting how the principal never is involved) anyway saying dd had a bad attitude and she was failing etc, dd told vp what she told Art teacher and even showed him (I saw it very pretty art project she did) but the Art teacher said it wasn't done right she gave her an F....anyway the vp said due to her attitude and failing Art she will have to have pbj and either it will be an apple or carrots and milk for the rest of the school year AND I still have to pay the same amount I pay for a hot lunch meal for her to have it and she gets less food.

As for the tardiness part I think it would be more beneficial say if the kids had to stay after school some sort of dentition...I know it is up to us parents to get them up or if they are going to impose this they should allow lunches to be brought from home.

ETA: just find out that for this lunch they put her in a dentition room for the rest of the year for lunch, so the whole lunch hour by herself in a room, not going to happen, her doctor while write a not saying that will not help her depression.

Edited by mdw2006, 06 March 2012 - 09:11 PM.

[SplashMom]

anyway the vp said due to her attitude and failing Art she will have to have pbj and either it will be an apple or carrots and milk for the rest of the school year AND I still have to pay the same amount I pay for a hot lunch meal for her to have it and she gets less food.

That has got to be one of the craziest things I've ever heard!!!! How is feeding your dd a pb&j sandwich every day supposed to improve your dd's attitude? If I were her, that would just piss me off even more. Do you not have the option of having her take her lunch to school instead of purchasing from the school?

[mdw2006]

anyway the vp said due to her attitude and failing Art she will have to have pbj and either it will be an apple or carrots and milk for the rest of the school year AND I still have to pay the same amount I pay for a hot lunch meal for her to have it and she gets less food.

That has got to be one of the craziest things I've ever heard!!!! How is feeding your dd a pb&j sandwich every day supposed to improve your dd's attitude? If I were her, that would just piss me off even more. Do you not have the option of having her take her lunch to school instead of purchasing from the school?

I am going to check, dd said mom I will eat the lunch (dh is like if she does they ARE NOT making us pay hot lunch prices)but what she is more concerned about is the isolation. That will make things much more worse, I have contacted her counselor to see what we need to do.

[Labyrinthine]

Mdw, I think you need to take it on up the chain. The hell!? She is failing a class so they are going to change her meals...AND make you pay the same amount?

Hell. No.

[baby duck]

The school your kids are at has some of the wackiest discipline standards I have ever heard. And I taught for 15 years.

I'm not getting the pb&j business for tardies. That wouldn't fly here. And having to sit in ISS for lunch because she's failing a class? Nope. Their consequences don't match the behavior.

It's not that hard. Tardy to school/class, you serve a detention. Tardy again, you serve another detention. This shouldn't be a difficult concept.

Failing the class is between the student, parents, teacher, and perhaps the college placement counselor. A bad attitude in class should start with the student, parents and teacher, too. And I'd want a definition of bad attitude. She's looking at the teacher funny? Tough noogies. The teacher can deal. She's mouthing off? That will be addressed by the parent. But to immediately "mention it" to the AP when I haven't called the parent yet? Shame on the teacher.

But this sitting in the ISS room for the rest of the year is ridiculous. It sounds like this school doesn't know how to handle teenagers at all, which is unbelievable since this is the business they are in.

I'm a little irritated by this again this morning.

[Nemeweh]

The school your kids are at has some of the wackiest discipline standards I have ever heard. And I taught for 15 years.

I'm not getting the pb&j business for tardies. That wouldn't fly here. And having to sit in ISS for lunch because she's failing a class? Nope. Their consequences don't match the behavior.

It's not that hard. Tardy to school/class, you serve a detention. Tardy again, you serve another detention. This shouldn't be a difficult concept.

Failing the class is between the student, parents, teacher, and perhaps the college placement counselor. A bad attitude in class should start with the student, parents and teacher, too. And I'd want a definition of bad attitude. She's looking at the teacher funny? Tough noogies. The teacher can deal. She's mouthing off? That will be addressed by the parent. But to immediately "mention it" to the AP when I haven't called the parent yet? Shame on the teacher.

But this sitting in the ISS room for the rest of the year is ridiculous. It sounds like this school doesn't know how to handle teenagers at all, which is unbelievable since this is the business they are in.

I'm a little irritated by this again this morning.

Not only that but the child has been dealing with the loss of her brother for what? A year? That's no amount of time at all.

EFF DD's school, Eff the art teacher and Eff the VP as well. Foot in azzes, M. Foot in Azzes

[mdw2006]

Almost a year, which the date is coming up and that is even harder.

I am not saying that excuses dd if she was mouthing off etc and if she was you get in touch with me to come down and talk about it, if a dentition is necessary that is fine...one dentition not the rest of the year.

I will be stepping it up.