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Trying to Remove BKs from LexisNexis? Read My Cautionary Tale First.

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So I disputed (or so I thought I disputed) addresses off the Big 4. TU removed all addresses except for my current. EQ has my current and another non-BK address. EX won't budge.

 

All bureaus froze. Microbilt, LexisNexis, SageStream, Chex, you name it. 

 

Try to get full verification of the bankruptcy on my file, thinking the whole Trial Rule 1005 thing would help me (this rule makes only the last 4 of your social, full name and addy public-facing).

 

No dice.

 

This was the response L/N fed me, including a few notes in RED.

 

Please critique, tell me I have no chance for removal, something....

 

Quote

 

To Whom It May Concern:

This correspondence is in response to the complaint LexisNexis Risk Solutions Inc. (“LexisNexis”) received from your office on 09/24/2020 on behalf of (Toast73) in which Toast73 disputes the alleged inaccurate reporting of bankruptcy record – case number (redacted) listed on his credit report. Thank you for your patience while we reviewed this matter and prepared the appropriate response.

Reinvestigation results: In an effort to resolve Toast73’s concerns, LexisNexis initiated a dispute of bankruptcy case – (redacted) on his behalf. During our re-investigation, LexisNexis verified the bankruptcy case (redacted) was filed on 02/15/2016 as a Chapter 7 and was discharged on 05/14/2016. Through a recollection of the bankruptcy, LexisNexis determined that the name, address and the last four digits of the social security number originally filed on a full bankruptcy docket obtained from Public Access to Court Electronic Records ("PACER") match Toast73’s name and address – (my BK address) and full social security number reported to LexisNexis by the nationwide consumer reporting agencies. (No mention of DOB, or who gave them my full social to match the full social NOT PUBLICLY AVAILABLE.) As a result, LexisNexis is unable to remove bankruptcy record - case number (redacted) from the consumer reports prepared by LexisNexis Risk Solutions Bureau LLC. Please note that per the Fair Credit Reporting Act (“FCRA”, 15 U.S.C § 1681 et seq.), bankruptcies may report for 10 years.

PACER is the system of record for bankruptcies. Please be advised that while the U.S. Bankruptcy Court may not provide information directly to consumer reporting agencies, bankruptcies are a matter of public record and can be obtained from PACER, which is an electronic public access service that allows users to obtain case and docket information online from federal appellate, district, and bankruptcy courts and is provided by the Federal Judiciary to allow public access to court information.

However, LexisNexis did initiate a dispute of the above said records with the nationwide consumer reporting agencies on his behalf. LexisNexis will notify Toast73 via mail once the credit bureau completes their investigation; however, please note, the bureau may contact Toast73 directly with the results of the investigation.

If Toast73 has any questions regarding how and what information is displayed on a credit bureau report, Toast73 will need to contact the credit bureau directly.

As your request relates to your LexisNexis Consumer Disclosure Report, there is no right to deletion for the information contained therein (hmmm.). In certain situations and for certain purposes, however, you may elect to opt out from having your information reported. Also, depending on the state of your residency, you may request that a “security freeze” be placed on information LexisNexis maintains about you, which will prohibit LexisNexis from releasing information in your credit report without your express authorization. Please note that a security freeze will remain in effect until you request otherwise. Also, the fact that your information is subject to a security freeze may be reported. To learn more about these and other important rights, please visit https://risk.lexisnexis.com/consumer-and-data-access-policies as well as https://consumer.risk.lexisnexis.com/rights.

Security Freeze added to Toast73’s RiskView file. As requested, on 09/24/2020, LexisNexis placed a security freeze on Toast73 file pursuant to the security freeze laws of her state of residence (I am in fact a male), Georgia (I'm a Hoosier, thank you), specifically, O.C.G.A. §§ 10-1-913 through 10-1-915 (great stuff, if I was a Georgian). LexisNexis also mailed a confirmation letter to Toast73 for his review. The confirmation letter advises that the security freeze will prevent LexisNexis from releasing his Benefits Assessment and RiskView report(s) or score(s) derived from the information therein. It also advises the security freeze does not apply to certain users of consumer reports, including those with whom Toast73 already has an existing account, who request his file for the purpose of, reviewing that account. As of 09/26/2020, this security freeze is active.

Opt-out processed from all public-facing products. LexisNexis processed Toast73 requests and opted his name and address out of our public-facing products pursuant to the Privacy Policy listed on our website, and a confirmation letter was mailed to his for review. Please be advised that her information will remain in the following products and services: restricted public records products which are available to commercial and government entities that meet LexisNexis credentialing requirements and are used to detect and prevent fraud, enforce transactions, perform due diligence, and other critical business and government functions; products regulated by the Fair Credit Reporting Act; third party data available through real time gateways; news; and legal documents.

Relation to the nationwide consumer reporting agencies. Please note LexisNexis Risk Data Management (“LexisNexis Data Management”), a LexisNexis Company, sells public records to a variety of customers, including consumer reporting agencies such as Equifax, Experian, and TransUnion (scraping public records has made these guys rich) LexisNexis Data Management is not a consumer reporting agency and therefore is not subject to the FCRA requirements for removal of a record if it cannot be verified.

LexisNexis Data Management’s role is limited to providing the consumer reporting agencies data it retrieves from bankruptcy, judgments, and liens public records from primary sources in bulk, including updates to existing records. These bulk records are not consumer reports as defined under the FCRA. The consumer reporting agency determines whether to include a particular public record in a specific consumer’s credit file, not LexisNexis Data Management. For more information on this interaction, please visit: https://equifaxconsumers.lexisnexis.com/.

 

 

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Is this an important step? I thought we were trying to freeze NL and dispute it off EQ/EX/TU.

 

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4 hours ago, CreditCurious20 said:

Has anyone actually had luck recently getting a BK deleted early? Aren't most of the CRAs going straight to PACER now? You cannot freeze PACER unfortunately.

PACER (pursuant to Federal Civil Rules of Procedure) only offers a name, address and last 4 of SSN.

 

If your BK address is old, and you removed it from all bureaus (including LN), there is no way to validate you are the petitioner. Therefore, they would have to delete it.

 

LN scrapes their data from courts. Courts neither furnish credit data to credit bureaus, nor will they validate records with anyone.

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2 hours ago, Toast73 said:

PACER (pursuant to Federal Civil Rules of Procedure) only offers a name, address and last 4 of SSN.

 

If your BK address is old, and you removed it from all bureaus (including LN), there is no way to validate you are the petitioner. Therefore, they would have to delete it.

 

LN scrapes their data from courts. Courts neither furnish credit data to credit bureaus, nor will they validate records with anyone.

Great in theory but not in reality. TU absolutely will verify through PACER regardless. And just because you got the address deleted, they still have it in their records. So if it ever was on your report they can match it. 

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5 hours ago, CreditCurious20 said:

Has anyone actually had luck recently getting a BK deleted early? Aren't most of the CRAs going straight to PACER now? You cannot freeze PACER unfortunately.

The new potential strategy that seems to be working is getting LN cleaned up but don't freeze it. Then when you dispute with the CRAs, LN will verify it doesn't exist and they won't bother going to PACER. They're only going to PACER because they can see LN is frozen. 

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8 hours ago, shifter said:

The new potential strategy that seems to be working is getting LN cleaned up but don't freeze it. Then when you dispute with the CRAs, LN will verify it doesn't exist and they won't bother going to PACER. They're only going to PACER because they can see LN is frozen. 

Also great in theory, be it not for the fact LN will verify your BK in PACER when you try to dispute it off.

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8 hours ago, shifter said:

The new potential strategy that seems to be working is getting LN cleaned up but don't freeze it. Then when you dispute with the CRAs, LN will verify it doesn't exist and they won't bother going to PACER. They're only going to PACER because they can see LN is frozen. 

Thanks. Doesn't LN already have your SSN?

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3 hours ago, CreditCurious20 said:

Thanks. Doesn't LN already have your SSN?

Credit bureaus give it to them. PACER only shows the last 4 in a BK proceeding.

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1 hour ago, Toast73 said:

Credit bureaus give it to them. PACER only shows the last 4 in a BK proceeding.

So in other words there is no more early deletion.  While PACER only shows the last four digits and your address, a court would likely find that sufficient to satisfy the FCRA (and court would be your only real remedy).  I am unaware of any case law so it appears to be a question of first impression. With that said, courts do not require proof beyond a reasonable doubt in civil cases and the burden of proof is the more permissive clear and convincing evidence or preponderance of the evidence standard. This would likely satisfy that burden. Moreover, any would be defendant could probably subpoena an unreacted copy in the lawsuit. Then the judge in your case would be pissed. Your suit would be dismissed, attorney's fees might be awarded against you, and some jurisdictions might even allow a law suit against you for damages arising from abuse of process or malicious (civil) prosecution. Similarly the FTC/CFPB won't care. Yep, early deletion is dead.

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4 hours ago, Toast73 said:

Also great in theory, be it not for the fact LN will verify your BK in PACER when you try to dispute it off.

Not really a theory. It has been done by a few people recently. Naturally nothing is foolproof but that seems to be the best strategy to start with. Of course the other good strategy is keep the BK from reporting to begin with. But that's another thread. That I already made. 

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2 hours ago, CreditCurious20 said:

So in other words there is no more early deletion.  While PACER only shows the last four digits and your address, a court would likely find that sufficient to satisfy the FCRA (and court would be your only real remedy).  I am unaware of any case law so it appears to be a question of first impression. With that said, courts do not require proof beyond a reasonable doubt in civil cases and the burden of proof is the more permissive clear and convincing evidence or preponderance of the evidence standard. This would likely satisfy that burden. Moreover, any would be defendant could probably subpoena an unreacted copy in the lawsuit. Then the judge in your case would be pissed. Your suit would be dismissed, attorney's fees might be awarded against you, and some jurisdictions might even allow a law suit against you for damages arising from abuse of process or malicious (civil) prosecution. Similarly the FTC/CFPB won't care. Yep, early deletion is dead.

TransUnion deleted Bk 13 4 months early. I disputed over phone.

 

Now Equifax and Experian hardly budged at all.

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10 hours ago, CreditCurious20 said:

So in other words there is no more early deletion.  While PACER only shows the last four digits and your address, a court would likely find that sufficient to satisfy the FCRA (and court would be your only real remedy).  I am unaware of any case law so it appears to be a question of first impression. With that said, courts do not require proof beyond a reasonable doubt in civil cases and the burden of proof is the more permissive clear and convincing evidence or preponderance of the evidence standard. This would likely satisfy that burden. Moreover, any would be defendant could probably subpoena an unreacted copy in the lawsuit. Then the judge in your case would be pissed. Your suit would be dismissed, attorney's fees might be awarded against you, and some jurisdictions might even allow a law suit against you for damages arising from abuse of process or malicious (civil) prosecution. Similarly the FTC/CFPB won't care. Yep, early deletion is dead.

 

While your assertion is as flawless as it gets, it draws the assumption that one would be suing LN or the CRA for credit reporting violations specifically related to reporting a legitimate bankruptcy (because illegitimate ones are easy to remove). Not only would this piss any seasoned judge off, you would be labeled a vexatious (and quite possibly mentally unstable) litigant.

 

You could (theoretically) file a Motion to Seal your BK, but your reasoning for such a request must be related to identity theft (or something equally horrendous). If such a motion was granted, your BK would then be pulled from public view.

 

That said, you are more than welcome to dispute information on your report to assure 100% accurate information is reported. The point of (so many) BK removal posts is compelling the CRA and LN to FULLY verify your BK, down to the last number in your case. In completing your dispute, the CRA and LN are required to perform a "reasonable" investigation, which includes verifying your full social security number, address, DOB and name. PACER gives LN last 4 of social, name and the FILING address. If you do not live at your filing address, and have had that address removed from the CRA and LN, they cannot legitimately verify the record based solely on your name and last 4, hence requiring the removal of said BK.

 

That's the working theory, at least. Yes, it does work 50% of the time after twenty disputes and a half million MOV letters followed by a CFPB and BBB complaint.

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11 hours ago, shifter said:

Not really a theory. It has been done by a few people recently. Naturally nothing is foolproof but that seems to be the best strategy to start with. Of course the other good strategy is keep the BK from reporting to begin with. But that's another thread. That I already made. 

I concur.

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FYI.  Pacer has something called "case index search".  This search allows a registered individual to search all 94 federal district courts, bankruptcy courts and appellate courts.  When you login one of the options now is "find bankruptcy by ssn/ein".  This option allows anyone to search for your case with your full social security number.  Remember the clerk puts your full social in their backend.  Keep this in mind as you fight your battle!  

 

Good luck

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15 hours ago, fedtrouble said:

FYI.  Pacer has something called "case index search".  This search allows a registered individual to search all 94 federal district courts, bankruptcy courts and appellate courts.  When you login one of the options now is "find bankruptcy by ssn/ein".  This option allows anyone to search for your case with your full social security number.  Remember the clerk puts your full social in their backend.  Keep this in mind as you fight your battle!  

 

Good luck

 

I'm wondering if a consumer can file a Motion to Seal citing ID theft or some other extenuating circumstance to prevent cases from appearing in courthouse searches.

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5 hours ago, Toast73 said:

 

I'm wondering if a consumer can file a Motion to Seal citing ID theft or some other extenuating circumstance to prevent cases from appearing in courthouse searches.

If you are going to file an Affidavit with a federal court that asserts you were a victim of identity theft, you had damned sure be ready to back it up.  And a pre-emptive concern won't carry the water on that one...

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5 hours ago, centex said:

If you are going to file an Affidavit with a federal court that asserts you were a victim of identity theft, you had damned sure be ready to back it up.  And a pre-emptive concern won't carry the water on that one...

That's why I started my post with "I wonder".

 

On another note, I am kinda salty that my EQ tanked 43 points when my BK and 1 chargeoff got removed.

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