Any idea why I'm still being denied for an AMEX Gold?

[kirr44]

I just started building credit since October. Never missed a payment. 

 

Got the AMEX Delta Gold in December and have always paid on time and even double paid some months. Paid well over the minimum, even 500 dollars.

 

So I guess I've only had an AMEX for 7 months but I'm continuously getting denied for the Gold Charge Card even when my Experian is 695.

 

They state the score is too low and the short history. Is that normal or just me? Any advice?

[cv91915]

33 minutes ago, kirr44 said:

Got the AMEX Delta Gold in December and have always paid on time and even double paid some months. Paid well over the minimum, even 500 dollars.

Amex prefers customers who PIF every month.  Stop carrying balances.

 

 

Edited June 30, 2020 by cv91915

[DPB]

41 minutes ago, cv91915 said:

Amex prefers customers who PIF every month.  Stop carrying balances.

 

 

This. Pay off your Delta card completely and then call recon.

[hegemony]

56 minutes ago, kirr44 said:

 

 

So I guess I've only had an AMEX for 7 months but I'm continuously getting denied for the Gold Charge Card even when my Experian is 695.

 

 

Is this a FICO score or a FAKO sKore? 695 is not exactly high. Keep in mind that Amex relies mostly on its own internal risk and PROFIT scores for decisioning applications. When you buy your score on myfico dot com what are the reasons given for why it is so low? That might help you figure out how to make your profile look more favourable.

[CTSoxFan]

57 minutes ago, kirr44 said:

I just started building credit since October. Never missed a payment. 

 

Got the AMEX Delta Gold in December and have always paid on time and even double paid some months. Paid well over the minimum, even 500 dollars.

 

So I guess I've only had an AMEX for 7 months but I'm continuously getting denied for the Gold Charge Card even when my Experian is 695.

 

They state the score is too low and the short history. Is that normal or just me? Any advice?

They tell you exactly the reason.  You have less than 1 year of history.  Give it a few months, and pay off the Delta balance and you'll probably be approved.

[kirr44]

Well I think because I applied for several credit cards and I recently had to buy some items, it took me down from a 705. But yeah not necessarily high. I just meant not bad.

 

I thought credit card companies would like that you leave a balance so they get interest on it?

[hegemony]

31 minutes ago, kirr44 said:

 

 

I thought credit card companies would like that you leave a balance so they get interest on it?

while it is true that most companies use profit modeling and anticipate some customers will be more profitable than others, carrying a balance -- consistently -- is indicative of a risky consumer. Moreover, there is no reason to pay interest. Think of it this way, by not paying in full when you can you are putting yourself in the same risk category as someone who CAN'T PIF.

[kirr44]

Then I'll be paying off now. 

 

Then I wonder why I couldn't even get a Chase Freedom card. Seems like Chase is more selective in regards to who they approve

[CTSoxFan]

30 minutes ago, kirr44 said:

Then I'll be paying off now. 

 

Then I wonder why I couldn't even get a Chase Freedom card. Seems like Chase is more selective in regards to who they approve

Time, time, time.  You need to understand all scores are not the same, and even though it says you have a FICO score of 705 or 695 that doesn't mean you'll get approved.  You should do some reading on how the FICO algorithms work, but you can have many very different credit profiles and have a score of 705.  You have what is called a thin file, which means not many accounts and they haven't been open very long.  Creditors want to see that you have a long history of paying your bills on time and that you have at least a few established accounts (ideally it is a mix with revolving (CCs) and installment (mortgage/auto, etc) accounts, but that isn't required).  Because you have a short history creditors are less likely to extend you a lot of credit as you haven't proven you can repay.  I would get 1-2 more cards then sit there and use and PIF those cards for 12-18 months.  In that time understand your spending patterns and find rewards cards that meet those spending patterns and your preferred rewards (cash, miles/points, etc).  Once the time has passed you'll be in a good place to get the best rewards cards for your strategy.  Look at my sig, credit is a marathon, not a sprint.

[kirr44]

So I guess that means, even if I PIF for several months, I still won't be approved for an AMEX Gold. 

 

I'm PIF from now on!!!

[centex]

1 hour ago, kirr44 said:

So I guess that means, even if I PIF for several months, I still won't be approved for an AMEX Gold. 

 

I'm PIF from now on!!!

Being PIF is a great way to go from here on out...however, you ALSO need to heed the guidance that others have given with respect to scoring.  Even having an 850 out of 850 on a Fair Isaac model does not guarantee someone a card.  You ALSO need to remember that AXP is NOT driven by Fair Isaac score models.  They have LONG used an internal model that results in people with seemingly low scores having been approved through the years.

 

As I recall, there were some years ago who actually found it easier to get the Platinum and then product change downwards.  I have no idea whether that is still a viable workaround.  The biggest obstacle right now on a travel-related charge card is that there isn't much travel spending going on right now, and if you are not showing them heavy spend, along with paying in full, then that will be a potential factor as well...

 

Remember that AXP is just like everyone else right now...lots of belt-tightening.  In other threads, we see banks pulling back BT offers and it seems that AXP got away from their personal loan product right around the time that 'rona entered the picture.  I don't know what this may be doing on the approval side for existing customers since I elected not to tempt fate with them by adding a fourth product...

[kirr44]

So do you think the "Prequalified Cards" section under my account is specifically tailored to each person or just the cards that they're trying to push to everyone?

[hegemony]

27 minutes ago, kirr44 said:

So do you think the "Prequalified Cards" section under my account is specifically tailored to each person or just the cards that they're trying to push to everyone?

those are pre-screened offers, you can check hard copies of your four major consumer credit reports to see Amex pulling softs (PRM) inquiries to make such offers.

[smartlypretty]

4 hours ago, kirr44 said:

I just started building credit since October. Never missed a payment. 

 

Got the AMEX Delta Gold in December and have always paid on time and even double paid some months. Paid well over the minimum, even 500 dollars.

 

So I guess I've only had an AMEX for 7 months but I'm continuously getting denied for the Gold Charge Card even when my Experian is 695.

 

They state the score is too low and the short history. Is that normal or just me? Any advice?

FWIW I have one collection dragging my score down and I do have a balance on another card. I got approved for Gold after my score per Amex fell to 657. I was clicking around and noticed the message changed from "expanding your membership is easy" to "get a decision in as little as 30 seconds." 

 

I did carry a balance before February, but I have been paying every card off and after I hit my CSP SUB I started using my BCE for everything. That seemed to trigger the Gold approval.

 

Now I have a business BBP with 0% for a year or so and I might use it to move part of my balance off my official balance -- I am on/off considering Platinum after this, and if they kept the credits, it would be a definite yes.

 

Based on AskSebby's calculator I would still profit if I got it without the new credits, but IDK. I can't tell if it's just fancy to me.

[shifter]

You're doing pretty well for less than 1 year of history. Give it time and stay on the right path PIF every month and you'll get those cards down the road. 

[kirr44]

So then I guess they will never list "not paying in full" as a deciding factor. It's just part of their algorithm.

[kirr44]

So would it be too crazy to set a goal and say I will have the Gold and Platinum Amex cards before the end of the year? It's a goal but I can definitely use the features even though the annual fees would be high.

[kirr44]

Off topic but I've learned more from y'all and this forum than I ever did watching Youtubers who solely focus on credit cards

[centex]

1 hour ago, kirr44 said:

So would it be too crazy to set a goal and say I will have the Gold and Platinum Amex cards before the end of the year? It's a goal but I can definitely use the features even though the annual fees would be high.

It's a goal...not one that makes sense though.  Given the overlap, what do gain from seeking to hold BOTH of them?  AND, of those potential benefits, do they outweigh the costs of holding both.  Remember...if you cannot extract AT LEAST the amount of an annual fee, then the card generally will not be worth the cost.

[smartlypretty]

8 hours ago, kirr44 said:

So would it be too crazy to set a goal and say I will have the Gold and Platinum Amex cards before the end of the year? It's a goal but I can definitely use the features even though the annual fees would be high.

FWIW, a lot of people hold both, and stagger the SUBs. As a non-traveler mostly, I'm on the fence about plat but still kinda interested.

 

There's a calculator on AskSebby for return on AF. 

[dvd]

On 7/2/2020 at 7:20 AM, kirr44 said:

So would it be too crazy to set a goal and say I will have the Gold and Platinum Amex cards before the end of the year? It's a goal but I can definitely use the features even though the annual fees would be high.

What is your current credit profile, ie, cards you have, balance/credit line, age of cards?

[cv91915]

On 7/2/2020 at 10:20 AM, kirr44 said:

So would it be too crazy to set a goal and say I will have the Gold and Platinum Amex cards before the end of the year? It's a goal but I can definitely use the features even though the annual fees would be high.

How much beyond the $800 in combined annual fees will you be able to recoup?

 

These two cards plus the Chase Sapphire Reserve have successfully relabeled getting your own money back as "credit card benefits."  

 

Take the $120 in dining credits on the Gold. 

 

You pay that money to Amex as part of your AF.  This is money you could have spent on anything -- rubber bands, Halloween costumes for your pets, another 6 months in the Yarn of the Month Club -- but if you hand it over to Amex you have to claw it back at the rate of $10 a month.  Plus you can only get your money back when you spend it with specific food merchants within a specific timeframe.  Makes zero sense to call that a benefit.  

 

It's very possible to get actual value from these cards, but it takes a lot of effort, a lot of spending, and/or a lot of knowledge of other loyalty programs (airlines, hotels).  Is that really something you want to volunteer for?  

[kirr44]

Just thought I might need to mention the CL on my delta gold is only 2,000. Would that be a factor?

 

Total on all cards is 7,500. (4 cards). Not good I know. But still hasn't been a year yet

[kirr44]

Also, if I plan to apply for the AMEX Gold, would it be a good idea to hold off on requesting for a CLI on my delta gold for now? And, I know until now I haven't been PIF.

Edited July 10, 2020 by kirr44

[cv91915]

6 hours ago, kirr44 said:

Also, if I plan to apply for the AMEX Gold, would it be a good idea to hold off on requesting for a CLI on my delta gold for now? And, I know until now I haven't been PIF.

Unlikely to matter either way.