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Economy Watch Thread

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44 minutes ago, creditmaze said:

I remember Mervyn's in our neighborhood but they went out of business during the Great Recession. They had a great buyer in the clothing dept at our store. Classic timeless career apparel. Now it's replaced with Kohls and sub standard in my opinion.

 

 

I don't think I ever bought anything at Mervyn's, but didn't they have a similar pricing strategy as Kohl's (price items way above retail and then start the "40% off everything" nonsense and then layer in a bunch of stackable coupons that finally brought the price of an item worth $15 down from $50 to $18)?

 

When the liquidators took over they marked everything down by just 20% and people were strangling each other in order to fill their carts with acrylic sweaters and animal print bathroom rug sets.

 

71Qyf+TIzAL._AC_SX522_.jpg

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
53 minutes ago, cv91915 said:

I don't think I ever bought anything at Mervyn's, but didn't they have a similar pricing strategy as Kohl's (price items way above retail and then start the "40% off everything" nonsense and then layer in a bunch of stackable coupons that finally brought the price of an item worth $15 down from $50 to $18)?

 

When the liquidators took over they marked everything down by just 20% and people were strangling each other in order to fill their carts with acrylic sweaters and animal print bathroom rug sets.

 

71Qyf+TIzAL._AC_SX522_.jpg

 

 

 

Hmmm no not really. The only thing I've bought at Kolhs are slippers in black. Their clothes for women with big loud prints are like nails on a chalkboard to me.

 

Before Covid-19 I enjoyed scoring a gem at Marshall's but that entails a lot of time sifting through the Sponge Bob attire.

Edited by creditmaze
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1 hour ago, cv91915 said:

Agreed, but Ross is also mentioned in the article.  They can rot in Hell.

 

I wrote them off when I found a pair of Spongebob Squarepants boxer shorts that had two price tags: one from Ross and one from Walmart. 

 

The Walmart tag had a lower price.  Never went back into a Ross store.

Now my husband sitting across from me wants to know...were you actually shopping for Spongebob  Squarepants boxers??!! My husband's discerning taste goes the way of Jedi vs Sith boxers. But hey, to each his own. 😉

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1 hour ago, creditmaze said:

Hmmm no not really. The only thing I've bought at Kolhs are slippers in black. Their clothes for women with big loud prints are like nails on a chalkboard to me.

 

Before Covid-19 I enjoyed scoring a gem at Marshall's but that entails a lot of time sifting through the Sponge Bob attire.

All of my flannel lounge pants are from Kohl's. 

 

When they transition from winter clothing to spring, they practically give these things away (sub-$3 range, if I recall correctly).  I miss FatWallet Forums.  That's how I'd find out about this stuff, and that tells you how long it's been since I've replenished my flannel collection.  😛 

 

I need a backup carry-on bag, so once everything opens back up I'll be at Marshalls pawing through the Nautica and Diane Von Furstenberg collections until I locate the one quality piece in the tri-county area. 

 

Even then I'll secretly know that I burned more in gas than I saved on the luggage.

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45 minutes ago, cv91915 said:

All of my flannel lounge pants are from Kohl's. 

 

When they transition from winter clothing to spring, they practically give these things away (sub-$3 range, if I recall correctly).  I miss FatWallet Forums.  That's how I'd find out about this stuff, and that tells you how long it's been since I've replenished my flannel collection.  😛 

 

I need a backup carry-on bag, so once everything opens back up I'll be at Marshalls pawing through the Nautica and Diane Von Furstenberg collections until I locate the one quality piece in the tri-county area. 

 

Even then I'll secretly know that I burned more in gas than I saved on the luggage.

I bought a carryon at Marshall's sometime back since my old carryon was 1" too wide for the airlines. Price was fair at $59. 

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Watching Jim Cramer interviewing Sec. Mnuchin on CNBC

 

FIFTY year Treasuries, Cramer?? YGBSM! Then Mnuchin comes back with "Buy a 30 year and a 20 year, that'll be a 50 year" - tongue had to be firmly in cheek for that one.

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Posted (edited)

And there is Terra Thomas, a florist in Oakland, Calif., who could pay her April rent with savings if she wanted but has decided to withhold the $833 she pays for her studio. With her usually busy wedding season shaping up to be grim, she’d rather conserve her money than pay bills now.

 

 

 

 

hard to dispute this from the comments "Why don't landlords have three months worth of expenses saved in case of a rainy day? Why don't they just go out and get a second job to help pay the costs of their properties? Why don't they tighten their belts and forego luxuries like avocado toast and five-dollar lattes? "

Edited by hegemony

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2 hours ago, hegemony said:

 

Change the header to "MAY qualify" and I have no qualms with the article.  (A friend forwarded the article to me earlier this am, knowing that I typically actively play in casinos 400+ hr annually.)

 

There's nothing in the article to substantiate such qualification, merely speculation that it may be possible.  My guess has been that gaming pros face an uphill climb to qualify for benefits -- although having a record of the IRS accepting related tax deductions on their returns (a tough hurdle) is a good first evidentiary step.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, hegemony said:

And there is Terra Thomas, a florist in Oakland, Calif., who could pay her April rent with savings if she wanted but has decided to withhold the $833 she pays for her studio. With her usually busy wedding season shaping up to be grim, she’d rather conserve her money than pay bills now.

 

 

 

 

hard to dispute this from the comments "Why don't landlords have three months worth of expenses saved in case of a rainy day? Why don't they just go out and get a second job to help pay the costs of their properties? Why don't they tighten their belts and forego luxuries like avocado toast and five-dollar lattes? "

The thing driving me crazy about this whole broader issue of rent and landlords etc is that everyone is acting like x amount of people decided to eff their landlords over when the economy is actually frozen.

We knew people wouldn't be able to pay rent, and no one did something. It's like every link in the chain expects someone else to figure out how we're going to do this, and everyone acts shocked when the first default domino falls. There was obviously only one real way for this not to happen (what the UK and Canada did) and we just flaked out on it, so this was inevitable. 

 

49 minutes ago, hdporter said:

 

Change the header to "MAY qualify" and I have no qualms with the article.  (A friend forwarded the article to me earlier this am, knowing that I typically actively play in casinos 400+ hr annually.)

 

There's nothing in the article to substantiate such qualification, merely speculation that it may be possible.  My guess has been that gaming pros face an uphill climb to qualify for benefits -- although having a record of the IRS accepting related tax deductions on their returns (a tough hurdle) is a good first evidentiary step.

Agggh, major pet peeve. Articles with a deliberately misleading headline.

Edited by smartlypretty
thought of more stuff i wanted to say

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9 hours ago, hegemony said:

And there is Terra Thomas, a florist in Oakland, Calif., who could pay her April rent with savings if she wanted but has decided to withhold the $833 she pays for her studio. With her usually busy wedding season shaping up to be grim, she’d rather conserve her money than pay bills now.

 

 

 

 

hard to dispute this from the comments "Why don't landlords have three months worth of expenses saved in case of a rainy day? Why don't they just go out and get a second job to help pay the costs of their properties? Why don't they tighten their belts and forego luxuries like avocado toast and five-dollar lattes? "

I have a reserve fund that will last more than three months. Quite a few of my tenants have been unable to pay rent already. I’ve told my tenants that they are not to choose between essentials and rent. It’s more important for them to have food and necessary items for their families.
 

That said, I have issues with the quote above. If lower-income people are getting stimulus checks and increased unemployment benefits, and most businesses qualify for forgivable loans, why should I be expected to “go out and get a second job?” Seems like a double standard. Besides for many, many landlords, being a landlord is a full time job. That wouldn’t leave time to work elsewhere to make up lost income while also performing the necessary tasks for maintaining their rentals. 

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8 hours ago, DPB said:

 

That said, I have issues with the quote above. If lower-income people are getting stimulus checks and increased unemployment benefits, and most businesses qualify for forgivable loans, why should I be expected to “go out and get a second job?” Seems like a double standard. Besides for many, many landlords, being a landlord is a full time job. That wouldn’t leave time to work elsewhere to make up lost income while also performing the necessary tasks for maintaining their rentals. 

um... it is sarcasm as the same argument is made about people who run short of rent/money.

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1 hour ago, hegemony said:

um... it is sarcasm as the same argument is made about people who run short of rent/money.

Ah...well...ok. 
Sarcasm isn’t always apparent in written form. Or at 3am after I had too much wine with dinner. 
Although, I have heard enough people make those exact comments without the sarcasm. 

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16 hours ago, hdporter said:

 

Change the header to "MAY qualify" and I have no qualms with the article.  (A friend forwarded the article to me earlier this am, knowing that I typically actively play in casinos 400+ hr annually.)

 

There's nothing in the article to substantiate such qualification, merely speculation that it may be possible.  My guess has been that gaming pros face an uphill climb to qualify for benefits -- although having a record of the IRS accepting related tax deductions on their returns (a tough hurdle) is a good first evidentiary step.

Concur with this...and hopefully, if they are actually going to do this, steps will be implemented to ensure that taxes were actually being filed.  There are far too many people that claim "professional gambler" or "poker player" as their profession but cannot be bothered to file taxes, knowing that the cash basis makes it next to impossible to track when they actually have assets/winnings in a given year. 

 

Sadly, with the helicoptering of monies, prudent steps will be skipped in the name of pandering...

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That didn't take long. If nobody else is paying, why should I? People are setting themselves up for disaster if they're deliberately deciding which bills they don't feel like paying already and will allow 3, 6, 18 months worth of every bill to go past due.

 

“I need to know that I can eat and pay for health care.”

 

When does people not eating or having insurance become a public health crisis?

 

3 hours ago, hegemony said:

um... it is sarcasm as the same argument is made about people who run short of rent/money.

 

I was having trouble telling whether it was sarcasm as well until I read the additional replies. The tone seemed sarcastic, but I'm sure there are those who believe landlords can go a few months without rent and small business owners with 3% profit margins should be able to survive and keep paying their employees.

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47 minutes ago, Shane1 said:

That didn't take long. If nobody else is paying, why should I? People are setting themselves up for disaster if they're deliberately deciding which bills they don't feel like paying already and will allow 3, 6, 18 months worth of every bill to go past due.

 

“I need to know that I can eat and pay for health care.”

 

When does people not eating or having insurance become a public health crisis?

 

 

I was having trouble telling whether it was sarcasm as well until I read the additional replies. The tone seemed sarcastic, but I'm sure there are those who believe landlords can go a few months without rent and small business owners with 3% profit margins should be able to survive and keep paying their employees.

how often do we refer over-spenders asking about credit or BK to the money saving threads in the MM forum? How many times have we heard people should just work a second job or cut expenses. Landlords aren't a special class although many people think they should get free gov't money instead of delivering pizzas.

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2 hours ago, hegemony said:

how often do we refer over-spenders asking about credit or BK to the money saving threads in the MM forum? How many times have we heard people should just work a second job or cut expenses. Landlords aren't a special class although many people think they should get free gov't money instead of delivering pizzas.

It's a big part of social media discourse right now and it is a little weird out of context, but it's also just pointing out the illogic of the original idea working stiffs affected by the pandemic can cut out lattes and avocado toast and drive for Uber to make sure their rent is paid on time -- when obviously all classes of people are stuck at home, and driving Uber is dangerous irrespective of your financial profile right now. 

 

(For instance, I live in a suburban epicenter, and even food is catch as catch can- my house is stocked, but we get Chipotle often in the event we need the stocked stuff later. I used to go to TJ's weekly, but shortages mean that supermarket trips are less planned, and I have to buy what they have, not what I necessarily planned to eat or feed my kids. And this issue is more acute supposedly for people using WIC, because if WIC approved food sells out, they might not be able to buy other milk, cereal, etc.) 

 

The underlying point is that there is no flow of cash from worker to landlord/business to corporations right now, the cashflow disruption at the worker level is trickling upwards, and the people in the categories where money comes from investments rather than labor might think labor and compensation for it will solve the problem -- as seen in 500 "bad landlord" emails going around all over the place. 

 

@DPB, it's very kind that you instructed your tenants this way, and perhaps that is occurring more places and just not going viral. But on Facebook and Reddit, there are a lot of circulating posts where landlords have written tenants (sometimes en masse without BCC) advising them of who is hiring and saying they expect rent to be paid before anything else -- there's even a FB group with subgroups called "Evil Landlords During Corona," collecting those messages. AFAIK there's no "Bro Landlords During Corona," but that itself is a larger sub-set of anti-landlord memes. 

 

And to echo the quoted post, frustrated bill-payers and renters are venting that anger by rhetorically asking why landlords or business owners cannot follow their own advice, and why only people on the bottom rungs are expected to somehow produce money during an emergent crisis and pandemic. 

 

And again I would say the issue is that money cannot truly be earned by many people during the pandemic, at all these levels, and other countries with adults in charge AND even the UK have addressed that issue at its core, ensuring people are paid at 80% so they aren't passing their brokeness upwards. 

 

Which is another facet of the issue, "broke" starts at the bottom, and quickly shoots upwards.

 

And in the US, it seems the approach to this has been "let the broke people figure out how to get money" and not "if we all don't ask for some sort of plan here, we're ALL gonna be broke soon."

 

Any other line of thinking, including "get a second job and cut luxuries" is purely magical thinking. As it stands as of today, IDK how we're even gonna pull out of the hole we dug with inaction.

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1 hour ago, smartlypretty said:

...other countries with adults in charge AND even the UK have addressed that issue at its core, ensuring people are paid at 80% so they aren't passing their brokeness upwards. 

 

Which is another facet of the issue, "broke" starts at the bottom, and quickly shoots upwards.

 

 

 

IMHO, this is/was the most effective measure; to inject cash directly into business to keep payroll during the shelter in place. 

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