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IvyMgmt

Early Warning

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18 hours ago, PotO said:

 

Jethro, does it hurt when you think?  Just how freaking r ... -- Oooops, can't use that word -- can you be?  Stick to something you have reasonable chance of success at like stealing shit from your neighbors.  

 

The issue isn't the agreement.  Any two-bit, trigger-pumping moron knows that when you apply for credit you agree to a ton of the same crap, yet we still have the option of a security freeze if we so desire.  

 

The issue, Jethro, isn't the Terms & Conditions.  The issue is why can't EW be frozen much the same way we can freeze LexisNexis.

Thank you PotO, this is exactly the salient issue in this thread.....

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Posted (edited)

So Early Warning referred Ivy to the FCRA Section 603(x):

 

(x) The term “nationwide specialty consumer reporting agency” means a

consumer reporting agency that compiles and maintains files on consumers

on a nationwide basis relating to--

(1) medical records or payments;

(2) residential or tenant history;

(3) check writing history;

(4) employment history; or

(5) insurance claims.

Edited by Rogue

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3 hours ago, Rogue said:

So Early Warning referred Ivy to the FCRA Section 603(x):

 

(x) The term “nationwide specialty consumer reporting agency” means a

consumer reporting agency that compiles and maintains files on consumers

on a nationwide basis relating to--

(1) medical records or payments;

(2) residential or tenant history;

(3) check writing history;

(4) employment history; or

(5) insurance claims.

 

In the FCRA when it describes credit freezes, it states that the following are the credit bureaus that must offer them:

 

603 (p)  The term “consumer reporting agency that compiles and maintains files on consumers on a nationwide basis” means a consumer reporting agency that regularly engages in the practice of assembling or evaluating, and maintaining, for the purpose of furnishing consumer reports to third parties bearing on a consumer’s credit worthiness, credit standing, or credit capacity, each of the following regarding consumers residing nationwide:

  • (1)  Public record information.
  • (2)  Credit account information from persons who furnish that information regularly and in the ordinary course of business.

LN offers the ability to freeze because their data is used in determining credit applications.  So do several other of the specialty CRAs.  I think the question is whether or not EW or its data used in the credit application process.  I'm guessing it is, but nobody has pressed the issue.  

 

Also, since EW is directly owned by banks, they have the tendency to be richardheads anyhow.  

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I think it just may be that nobody has yet pressed EW on the issue of credit freezes.  I am going to call them next week when I have a minute and mess with them....

 

I know EW is owned by part of the banking cartel, however I wonder how the non-EW owner banks feel about supporting an ongoing enterprise of their direct competitors?

 

Early Warning Services (EWS) is owned by Bank of America, BB&T, JPMorgan Chase, PNC, Wells Fargo and Capital One. Formed to combat fraud in the financial industry, EWS makes it possible for banks to easily exchange information between organizations in order to prevent and combat fraud.

 

https://rebuildcreditscores.com/early-warning-services/

 

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Posted (edited)

The operative words in the FCRA for exemption are High Risk Fraud Search and Fraud Detect.  EWS is skirting the freeze option because their primary function is to detect and report potential or "fraudulent" banking transactions. They think the FCRA gives them a loophole. It wasn't so long ago, they would tell callers they weren't a CRA. They finally caved in and started offering the free annual consumer report.

 

Like a lot of specialty CRAs they operated in the shadows after the owning banks creating them.  Because there has been no resistance, or public backlash, they'll keep that playbook. Personally, I think they should be challenged because they gather and store negative account information submitted because of ID theft. Many victims are adversely affected because of the false information stored in their databases.

Edited by tmcgill

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On 7/10/2019 at 5:30 AM, IvyMgmt said:

I don't recall saying that...

freezing is designed to help those with ID theft isn't it?

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8 hours ago, hegemony said:

freezing is designed to help those with ID theft isn't it?

 

There are other uses.  You know that. 

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On 7/13/2019 at 6:07 PM, hegemony said:

freezing is designed to help those with ID theft isn't it?

Umm I know you know its not... I won't even begin to explain it..

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On 7/12/2019 at 8:53 AM, tmcgill said:

The operative words in the FCRA for exemption are High Risk Fraud Search and Fraud Detect.  EWS is skirting the freeze option because their primary function is to detect and report potential or "fraudulent" banking transactions. They think the FCRA gives them a loophole. It wasn't so long ago, they would tell callers they weren't a CRA. They finally caved in and started offering the free annual consumer report.

 

Like a lot of specialty CRAs they operated in the shadows after the owning banks creating them.  Because there has been no resistance, or public backlash, they'll keep that playbook. Personally, I think they should be challenged because they gather and store negative account information submitted because of ID theft. Many victims are adversely affected because of the false information stored in their databases.

 

Thank you for that because I will sure challenge this like I have challenged a few others ans won.. You can't say you are a Reporting Agency then tell some they can't freeze information you are reporting about them.. and these blanket statements from banks of "sharing" its no damn way no one other than my bank should know my ACH reporting activities especially if they are in the confines of paying bills.. Why does someone else need to know this and report this.. its wrong wrong wrong!

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On 7/12/2019 at 12:36 AM, Rogue said:

I think it just may be that nobody has yet pressed EW on the issue of credit freezes.  I am going to call them next week when I have a minute and mess with them....

 

I know EW is owned by part of the banking cartel, however I wonder how the non-EW owner banks feel about supporting an ongoing enterprise of their direct competitors?

 

Early Warning Services (EWS) is owned by Bank of America, BB&T, JPMorgan Chase, PNC, Wells Fargo and Capital One. Formed to combat fraud in the financial industry, EWS makes it possible for banks to easily exchange information between organizations in order to prevent and combat fraud.

 

https://rebuildcreditscores.com/early-warning-services/

 

 

Please let me know your outcome I would love to know how they explain this!

 

No credit unions participate in this ball of madness...

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2 hours ago, IvyMgmt said:

Umm I know you know its not... I won't even begin to explain it..

 

well okay then. have a great day and good luck

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7 hours ago, IvyMgmt said:

 

Thank you for that because I will sure challenge this like I have challenged a few others ans won.. You can't say you are a Reporting Agency then tell some they can't freeze information you are reporting about them.. and these blanket statements from banks of "sharing" its no damn way no one other than my bank should know my ACH reporting activities especially if they are in the confines of paying bills.. Why does someone else need to know this and report this.. its wrong wrong wrong!

 

The FCRA seems clear:

 

603 (p)  The term “consumer reporting agency that compiles and maintains files on consumers on a nationwide basis” means a consumer reporting agency that regularly engages in the practice of assembling or evaluating, and maintaining, for the purpose of furnishing consumer reports to third parties bearing on a consumer’s credit worthiness, credit standing, or credit capacity, each of the following regarding consumers residing nationwide:

  • (1)  Public record information.
  • (2)  Credit account information from persons who furnish that information regularly and in the ordinary course of business.

The above describes who the FCRA obligates to provide freezes.

 

You will need to prove that EW data is used in credit decisions.  A checking account is not credit.  

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Don't you just love shades of gray?

 

When you apply for overdraft protection, many banks will run Chexsystems and/or Early Warning before you are approved. I called Bank of America once to inquire why, and was told overdraft protection is considered a temporary loan, and they need to see if you are "credit worthy" in your banking transactions.

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27 minutes ago, tmcgill said:

Don't you just love shades of gray?

 

When you apply for overdraft protection, many banks will run Chexsystems and/or Early Warning before you are approved. I called Bank of America once to inquire why, and was told overdraft protection is considered a temporary loan, and they need to see if you are "credit worthy" in your banking transactions.

 

That's logical, I suppose.

 

But what if I always decline OD protection?  

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Posted (edited)

Early Warning and Chexsystems are run when you apply for a checking and savings, if that financial institution has an account with them.  Some banks and credit unions run it again if you ask for overdraft protection. Depending on the services they purchased, some get alerts from EWS and Chex if negative information is added to your file.  If you don't apply for ODP, they only run it when you first apply, unless something negative pops up in your file.  **It all depends on the services the financial institution purchased from them.

 

The fact that Early Warning is collecting data and selling that information to determine if you are "credit worthy" for a bank or credit union account, means they function as a CRA.  You should be able to freeze that file if you document you are a victim of ID theft.

 

I think a large number of CPB complaints (before it got its legs cut off), prompted them to start providing the consumer reports. A while back, they were just telling you if there was something negative over the phone (and only after you gave them a lot of your personal data).

 

If an individual has a fraudulent account opened or compromised in their name, with overdrafts, bad checks or check kiting, there is a good chance they'll be reported to EWS. Unlike Chexsystems, EWS is usually the kiss of death, because it is considered the fraud watchdog.  No second chance banking is available with that bank or credit union. Many banks will open an account, order checks and debit card, then run EWS. If anything negative is on the report, they'll close the account pronto.

 

 

 

 

Edited by tmcgill

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8 hours ago, tmcgill said:

Early Warning and Chexsystems are run when you apply for a checking and savings, if that financial institution has an account with them.  Some banks and credit unions run it again if you ask for overdraft protection. Depending on the services they purchased, some get alerts from EWS and Chex if negative information is added to your file.  If you don't apply for ODP, they only run it when you first apply, unless something negative pops up in your file.  **It all depends on the services the financial institution purchased from them.

 

The fact that Early Warning is collecting data and selling that information to determine if you are "credit worthy" for a bank or credit union account, means they function as a CRA.  You should be able to freeze that file if you document you are a victim of ID theft.

 

I think a large number of CPB complaints (before it got its legs cut off), prompted them to start providing the consumer reports. A while back, they were just telling you if there was something negative over the phone (and only after you gave them a lot of your personal data).

 

If an individual has a fraudulent account opened or compromised in their name, with overdrafts, bad checks or check kiting, there is a good chance they'll be reported to EWS. Unlike Chexsystems, EWS is usually the kiss of death, because it is considered the fraud watchdog.  No second chance banking is available with that bank or credit union. Many banks will open an account, order checks and debit card, then run EWS. If anything negative is on the report, they'll close the account pronto.

 

 

 

 

 

Ok, let's forget about deposit accounts for now and focus on credit ... pure credit.  EWS will claim there is no "credit" involved when opening a savings account or a checking w/o OD facility.

 

How exactly does a credit card company use EWS when you apply for their credit card?  

 

With LN it's easy to show their involvement in the credit process with the "Four Stupid Questions" they often provide for ID verification when you apply.  And that's probably where LN was forced (volunteered??) to provide a freeze function.

 

How exactly does a credit card company use EWS when you apply for their credit card?  

 

 

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Posted (edited)

EWS is the fraud watchdog for **banks and credit unions** (It was created by several of the large banks.)

 

That's the gray area. Is opening a checking or savings considered an extension of credit? I've had more than one bank say it is.

 

Interested in hearing opinions and thoughts on this.

Edited by tmcgill

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9 hours ago, tmcgill said:

EWS is the fraud watchdog for **banks and credit unions** (It was created by several of the large banks.)

 

That's the gray area. Is opening a checking or savings considered an extension of credit? I've had more than one bank say it is.

 

Interested in hearing opinions and thoughts on this.

 

You didn't answer the question.  How exactly does a credit card company use EWS when you apply for their credit card?  

 

Which banks have told you that opening a savings account or a checking account (w/o OD facility) is an extension of credit?  

 

I think there is a better chance of bringing EWS to the table when we can show that EWS is involved when you apply for a credit card or loan.  

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Posted (edited)

I thought it was already understood that EWS is a CRA for bank and credit union accounts. Credit card issuers have not been known to run EWS for approvals - or banks for loans. 

 

In the course of troubleshooting and helping others here on CB, I called Chase Bank about 3 years ago to ask why they reported charged off checking accounts to Experian, Transunion or Equifax - when they have already reported to Chexsystems. A couple was trying to buy a house, and the bank had reported them for a charged off bank account. I finally got a manager on the phone who said the bank provides the accountholder their processing services and the accountholder has a legal agreement to pay monthly transactional fees. She said accountholders deposit items for negotiation and Chase provides the funds until the issuing bank pays them. She said Chase has the right to report those accounts to the credit bureaus when accountholders owe them and don't pay.

Edited by tmcgill

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2 hours ago, tmcgill said:

I thought it was already understood that EWS is a CRA for bank and credit union accounts. Credit card issuers have not been known to run EWS for approvals - or banks for loans. 

 

In the course of troubleshooting and helping others here on CB, I called Chase Bank about 3 years ago to ask why they reported charged off checking accounts to Experian, Transunion or Equifax - when they have already reported to Chexsystems. A couple was trying to buy a house, and the bank had reported them for a charged off bank account. I finally got a manager on the phone who said the bank provides the accountholder their processing services and the accountholder has a legal agreement to pay monthly transactional fees. She said accountholders deposit items for negotiation and Chase provides the funds until the issuing bank pays them. She said Chase has the right to report those accounts to the credit bureaus when accountholders owe them and don't pay.

 

I've never heard of people with bank accounts gone bad being reported to the credit bureaus, but I do not doubt what you say at all.

 

With what you described, a checking account could be considered a credit account.  Then the FCRA would seem to force EWS to provide freezes. 

 

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It happens, and also occurs when banks turn those charged off accounts to CAs.  The CA then adds it to one or more of the big three. I guess the takeaway from this thread is the loopholes available to speciality CRAs, and how it negatively affects consumers.

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What would it take to make EWS see the light?  I don't think we can count on timely assistance from the government. 

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1 hour ago, PotO said:

What would it take to make EWS see the light?  I don't think we can count on timely assistance from the government. 

NOW HERE COMES POTO, PROPER PERSON...

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1 hour ago, hegemony said:

NOW HERE COMES POTO, PROPER PERSON...

 

Hmmm ... if I can make money on it ...

 

 

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