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IndyPoolPlayer

Another For-Profit Diploma Mill Bites The Dust?

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There's an article in the latest issue of Consumer Reports that goes into detail about the trillions of dollars of student loans people are saddled with.

 

This makes me feel guilty, as I went to college when the fees were cheap at the California State University campus I attended. It wasn't even $500 a semester. I think $300-$400. I paid it all in full as I went, starting with money I earned from my first job (Taco Bell).

 

Now it's many thousands of $$$ per semester, as state funding has dwindled. If I was in the same position today, I also would have to take out loans like this, then worry about that mountain of debt after I graduate.

Edited by Burgerwars

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There's an article in the latest issue of Consumer Reports that goes into detail about the trillions of dollars of student loans people are saddled with thought were a great idea when they were handed the money, and agreed to pay back.

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There's an article in the latest issue of Consumer Reports that goes into detail about the trillions of dollars of student loans people are saddled with.

 

This makes me feel guilty, as I went to college when the fees were cheap at the California State University campus I attended. It wasn't even $500 a semester. I think $300-$400. I paid it all in full as I went, starting with money I earned from my first job (Taco Bell).

 

Now it's many thousands of $$$ per semester, as state funding has dwindled. If I was in the same position today, I also would have to take out loans like this, then worry about that mountain of debt after I graduate.

 

That's only a small part of the equation. Basically it is these administration heavy bureaucracies and Trustees/Regents (usually elected by the Alumni associations) that like to spend big on pet projects and not necessarily for things that directly benefit students. It was discussed on here before the cat-and-mouse game between the Feds with huge loans being guaranteed to students and the corresponding increases in tuition.

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There's an article in the latest issue of Consumer Reports that goes into detail about the trillions of dollars of student loans people are saddled with thought were a great idea when they were handed the money, and agreed to pay back.

Yes, but people should really do their research before pursuing that 100k humanities degree that they can wipe their posterior with.

 

I know people with the most oddball degrees and others with degrees in elementary education that can't land a job as the market is saturated.A service advisor I worked with has a Bachelor's in history. Great its doing him well checking in vehicles for service.

 

While I'm all about achieving your dreams and goals. It's best to have a solid plan and be realistic. And do your research on your field of study. I am sure all the headhunters at the schools will tell you how you can make millions off their photography degree program

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As far as what your degree is in, it doesn't tie you to that for the rest of your life. It's what you do with your life.

 

I work in the IT field, but my degree is the furthest thing from it. I'm still glad I got the degree. Of course I'm also glad I finished college without being a zillion dollars in debt.

Edited by Burgerwars

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As far as what your degree is in, it doesn't tie you to that for the rest of your life. It's what you do with your life.

 

I work in the IT field, but my degree is the furthest thing from it. I'm still glad I got the degree. Of course I'm also glad I finished college without being a zillion dollars in debt.

While this is very true as I have a AAS in emergency medical services and haven't been in the back of an ambulance going on 2 years.

 

I think the idea of pursuing a degree should be considered much heavier with the idea of what's it gonna be in 2 years post college? If your going to run the risk of high debt. And possibly not getting into your field. You might want to find a good back up plan to pay your loans.

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Went to ITT...ya that school sucked a big one. When there was an investigation around 2000/2001, we were told to keep our mouth shut :\

I want to say that I went to I.T.T. in 2006 and I do agree with this. (The Pennsylvania locations were only Associates level degrees, as well.) I felt it was a "diploma mill," and I did eventually stop going. Their way of testing and etc seemed so low-bar I was wondering what I was doing there, and I did not feel challenged nor engaged. This is a personal recollection.

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Went to ITT...ya that school sucked a big one. When there was an investigation around 2000/2001, we were told to keep our mouth shut :\

I want to say that I went to I.T.T. in 2006 and I do agree with this. (The Pennsylvania locations were only Associates level degrees, as well.) I felt it was a "diploma mill," and I did eventually stop going. Their way of testing and etc seemed so low-bar I was wondering what I was doing there, and I did not feel challenged nor engaged. This is a personal recollection.

See now I attended UTI. *universal technical institute* I graduated high honors. While I have a great depth of knowledge when it comes to autos. I was weak in transmissions and differentials. I also learned some serious diagnostic skills I never seen or heard of. It made me better I have read reviews of people saying it sucked and they didn't learn a Damn thing and people bitching that the graduation rate was only 79%. Well that tells me one thing if the graduation rate is teetering low. Then I know they aren't just handing out passing grades. For me it was easy, others struggled

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And ITT Tech is still on life support with its accreditors...

 

http://www.ibj.com/articles/60010-group-delays-decision-on-itt-educationals-accreditation

 

 

Carmel-based for-profit college operator ITT Educational Services Inc. has received a brief reprieve from its accreditor, which has delayed making a decision that could potentially devastate the embattled company.

The Accrediting Council for Independent Colleges and Schools sent a letter to ITT on Wednesday to inform the company that it has continued until December an existing show-cause directive, meaning the company needs to provide more evidence for why its accreditation should not be ended.

ITT Tech announced the letter in an securities filing to its shareholders.

Previously, ACICS has questioned ITT’s “administrative capacity, organizational integrity, financial viability and ability to serve students that complies with ACICS standards.”

Staying in compliance with the ACICS is important for ITT because the company would lose its federal funding for student loans without it. Most of ITT's revenue comes from federal loan funding.

ITT met with ACICS officials in early August in an attempt to prove its compliance with the group’s accrediting standards. Now it needs to provide more evidence to ACICS by Nov. 1.

"We are pleased to provide ACICS with additional information in its review of our current accreditation status,” ITT spokeswoman Nicole Elam told IBJ in an email. "None of the matters cited and pending in the show-cause directive have resulted in any findings of fact by a court of law—which we emphasized in our August hearing with the accreditor."

It’s been a turbulent year for ITT and the for-profit education industry. ACICS is itself under scrutiny from the federal government, which has made steps to shut it down. If that happens, it could affect more than 50,000 Indiana students at a variety of institutions, including ITT Technical Institute, which has campuses across the state.

In June, the Department of Education sent a letter ordering ITT to show that it has more than $123.6 million available to refund students in the event the company shuts down unexpectedly, an increase from its previous required $79.9 million on hand in light of scrutiny from ACICS.

The ACICS said ITT was facing civil investigative demands from 19 state attorneys general regarding marketing, recruitment, financial aid, academic advising, career services, admission practices, accreditation, graduation rates and job-placement performance.

In addition, the ACICS said ITT faces litigation and investigations from three federal agencies related to the school’s “student-lending practices and misrepresentations to investors.”

Elam said the moves are a result of the targeting of for-profit college sector.

"Career colleges continue to be targeted and remain under extremely aggressive regulatory oversight in this highly charged political atmosphere, which has only been further exacerbated by an election year,” Elam said. "As always, we remain focused on serving our students and strongly believe that we have and will continue to meet the ACICS accreditation standards."

ITT shares were up 4 cents Thursday morning, to $2.22 each. The stock has fallen 40 percent since the beginning of the year.

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The hits just keep on coming for ITT Technical Institute - http://www.ibj.com/articles/60138-itt-shares-plunge-64-percent-in-wake-of-federal-mandates

Shares in ITT Educational Services Inc. went into a freefall Friday, one day after the U.S. Department of Education banned the Carmel-based for-profit educator from enrolling new students who receive federal aid.

Investment analysts predicted that ITT isn’t likely to survive the decision.

The stock was down 64 percent from the opening bell in late-morning trading Friday, to 49 cents per share, and has lost 85 percent of its value since the beginning of the year. The stock traded at $8.35 per share two years ago and at more than $125 per share seven years ago.

The education department said Thursday’s decision was made after ITT fell out of compliance with its accreditor’s standards and “put its students and millions of dollars in taxpayer-funded federal student aid at risk.”

The ban is potential death sentence for ITT, which last year received 79 percent of its cash receipts from the federal student loan program.


This follows a ban on federal student loans to ITT Tech

Edited by IndyPoolPlayer

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I wish they would start taking the hammer to private (non-profit) and even public colleges that don't turn out anything consistently useful.

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Went to ITT...ya that school sucked a big one. When there was an investigation around 2000/2001, we were told to keep our mouth shut :\

I want to say that I went to I.T.T. in 2006 and I do agree with this. (The Pennsylvania locations were only Associates level degrees, as well.) I felt it was a "diploma mill," and I did eventually stop going. Their way of testing and etc seemed so low-bar I was wondering what I was doing there, and I did not feel challenged nor engaged. This is a personal recollection.

 

I have a family member who did this for a "criminal justice" BS and by BS I mean Geronimo . Her debt is around $90k for this degree. She had no idea how much money she was agreeing to, because they "handled all the financial aid paperwork for you" and the highest paying job she's gotten since graduating has been for $11.50/hr. She doesn't correlate that her "degree" on her resume is hurting her chances and I've tried to help but have back off in recent years because I realize she was the perfect target for a place like ITT Tech. I feel bad for her. She can't afford her debt and will likely have it the rest of her life. She is currently doing income based repayment so she's not making a dent at all in her loans. She also paid some third party to set this up for her when she could have done it herself. I gave up - she's an easy target and no matter how much I tried to help her, it was going over her head.

 

I really wanted to help her with her credit to give her something positive to think about. Her reports were clean, she only had the loans on them and no lates because she had been deferring or paying minimums. But she recently *Admin removes vulgarity*ed them up with two CC's she got and didn't "understand" how to use.

 

Hate seeing her in this endless loop of debt and stress and low wages but I can't help her either.

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Just heard I.T.T. Tech will be closing its doors. This morning.

 

I went to I.T.T. Briefly. It was not a good school.

 

And my "debts" just keep going away... :yahoo:

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Just heard I.T.T. Tech will be closing its doors. This morning.

 

I went to I.T.T. Briefly. It was not a good school.

 

And my "debts" just keep going away... :yahoo:

That's something to be proud of. Do you pay any of your bills, ever?

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The for profit schools are getting all of the negative attention, with good cause.

 

However don't be fooled into thinking that public or non-profit schools are innocent. They are also feeding at the federal student loan spigot.

 

With unlimited student loans, ALL schools (including public) have no incentive to control costs.

 

Their "profits" might not be going to shareholders, but instead they are going to bloated administrations and tenured professors. Salaries and pensions above $200,000 per year are becoming very common in academia.

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http://www.ibj.com/articles/60231-itt-tech-wont-say-whether-it-will-file-for-bankruptcy-protection

Is bankruptcy inevitable for Carmel-based ITT Educational Services Inc.?

CEO Kevin Modany wouldn’t say Tuesday morning in the wake of the company's announcement that the for-profit education provider—which ran 130 college campuses in 38 states—would cease operations and has eliminated most of its 8,000 workers.

“We don’t have any details to share at this point,” Modany told IBJ on a conference call with other reporters. “We certainly can note we’re dealing with limited resources right now. There is limited to no intake in terms of revenue. We’re using available resources and staff."

The company, which reported nearly $850 million in revenue in 2015, listed assets of $584.9 million and liabilities of $419.8 million as of its June 30 financial statements.

The federal government is holding about $90 million of ITT’s assets in a surety account, Modany said. In addition, the company owes tens of millions of dollars on student loans for which borrowers defaulted and the company serves as guarantor.

Bankruptcy was the fate of Corinthian Colleges, the other high-profile for-profit education company that ceased operations. The company shut down last year amid accusations it deceived students with inflated job placement rates and used inappropriate, strong-arm student-recruitment tactics.

 

[snip]

“We’ll have to liquidate those assets and … figure out a way to distribute it,” Modany said.

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The for profit schools are getting all of the negative attention, with good cause.

 

However don't be fooled into thinking that public or non-profit schools are innocent. They are also feeding at the federal student loan spigot.

 

With unlimited student loans, ALL schools (including public) have no incentive to control costs.

 

Their "profits" might not be going to shareholders, but instead they are going to bloated administrations and tenured professors. Salaries and pensions above $200,000 per year are becoming very common in academia.

.

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The for profit schools are getting all of the negative attention, with good cause.

 

However don't be fooled into thinking that public or non-profit schools are innocent. They are also feeding at the federal student loan spigot.

 

With unlimited student loans, ALL schools (including public) have no incentive to control costs.

 

Their "profits" might not be going to shareholders, but instead they are going to bloated administrations and tenured professors. Salaries and pensions above $200,000 per year are becoming very common in academia.

:rolleyes: "unlimited students loans"

 

I guess you didn't notice that most states cut funding of higher ed a lot since 1990. I guess higher tuition should not be expected with such cuts.

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The for profit schools are getting all of the negative attention, with good cause.

 

However don't be fooled into thinking that public or non-profit schools are innocent. They are also feeding at the federal student loan spigot.

 

With unlimited student loans, ALL schools (including public) have no incentive to control costs.

 

Their "profits" might not be going to shareholders, but instead they are going to bloated administrations and tenured professors. Salaries and pensions above $200,000 per year are becoming very common in academia.

:rolleyes: "unlimited students loans"

 

I guess you didn't notice that most states cut funding of higher ed a lot since 1990. I guess higher tuition should not be expected with such cuts.

 

 

 

I am referring to Grad Plus loans which currently charge about 6%

 

That allows clueless people to get into 6 figure levels of student loan debt for basically worthless graduate degrees with no hope of ever paying them off.

 

For example, most law degrees these days cost about $150,000 to $200,000 to obtain. But other than the few people that make BigLaw (T14 schools) the bulk of the students graduating from 2nd, 3rd and 4th tier law school are doomed before they even started. At best they will make $40,000 to $50,000 and never be able to repay their student loans. Something like 50% of law school graduates NEVER get a job that requires their legal degree. Google : Law School Scam

 

There are numerous other worthless degrees being offered by public and non-profit schools that have no path to the graduate ever repaying their student debt. These worthless degrees are just designed to use the students as a federal loan conduit to support the administrators and the tenured faculty. The universities know that these degrees are worthless, but they continue to sucker kids into them.

Edited by RocketGoBoom

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The for profit schools are getting all of the negative attention, with good cause.

 

However don't be fooled into thinking that public or non-profit schools are innocent. They are also feeding at the federal student loan spigot.

 

With unlimited student loans, ALL schools (including public) have no incentive to control costs.

 

Their "profits" might not be going to shareholders, but instead they are going to bloated administrations and tenured professors. Salaries and pensions above $200,000 per year are becoming very common in academia.

:rolleyes: "unlimited students loans"

 

I guess you didn't notice that most states cut funding of higher ed a lot since 1990. I guess higher tuition should not be expected with such cuts.

 

 

 

I am referring to Grad Plus loans which currently charge about 6%

 

That allows clueless people to get into 6 figure levels of student loan debt for basically worthless graduate degrees with no hope of ever paying them off.

 

For example, most law degrees these days cost about $150,000 to $200,000 to obtain. But other than the few people that make BigLaw (T14 schools) the bulk of the students graduating from 2nd, 3rd and 4th tier law school are doomed before they even started. At best they will make $40,000 to $50,000 and never be able to repay their student loans. Something like 50% of law school graduates NEVER get a job that requires their legal degree. Google : Law School Scam

 

There are numerous other worthless degrees being offered by public and non-profit schools that have no path to the graduate ever repaying their student debt. These worthless degrees are just designed to use the students as a federal loan conduit to support the administrators and the tenured faculty. The universities know that these degrees are worthless, but they continue to sucker kids into them.

 

 

bye bye :wave:

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I dated (and lived with for a time when I was in Chicago) a DePaul Law grad who graduated with a solid 2.0 GPA. After graduation his student loan payments were almost $1,000 a month. He was making about $42,000 a year. We had nothing to spend on entertainment. I finally left when a friend pointed out that he looked like a crash test dummy with hair.

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I dated (and lived with for a time when I was in Chicago) a DePaul Law grad who graduated with a solid 2.0 GPA. After graduation his student loan payments were almost $1,000 a month. He was making about $42,000 a year. We had nothing to spend on entertainment. I finally left when a friend pointed out that he looked like a crash test dummy with hair.

I know plenty of stories like that. very different than using ignorant blanket statements about higher ed.

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