The condescension of our “betters� never ceases to amaze me

[BobWang]

We are being sold a bill of goods with the promise that it will help Main Street.

Well, Main Street seems to be dead set against it.

BUT, our “betters†will try to ram it through anyway, for OUR benefit, not THEIRS.

WE are apparently self-destructive and incapable of doing what is in OUR best interest.

In fact, THEY have to tell US what we should be doing for our own good.

Last time I checked, this was a free country, and we should be permitted to decide our own destinies.

I, for one, trust Main Street more than Wall Street.

Bob

P.S. No need to respond, I just had to rant.

[Carboran]

Really? I think I don't want to trust people who tell me that we should just give the bailout money to the average Joe, and that if we did that, (somehow based on some unknown math) we would all get 250k EACH. Or that 700bn dollars will cost each of us $500 a month for 10 years.

 

I am just curious, how many of the people, who are so dead set against this are against auto industry subsidies, farming subsidies etc.

 

And how many people realize what a huge portion of taxes are paid by Wall Street firms? Just an example, 25% of NY STATE TAXES are paid by 7% of PEOLE IN NYC, those who work on Wall St. Yeah, it sure would be awesome, when NY can't fix the roads or the hospitals and pay the policemen and the firemen.

Edited September 30, 2008 by Carboran

[Saria]

Unfortunately, much of Main Street doesn't actually understand what's going on. Personally, I reluctantly support a bailout in some form, but I have the utmost respect for folks who are informed about the situation and the proposal and feel that a bailout is not the best course of action (and I count you in this camp, Bob). However, I'm very frustrated and disheartened by the railing against this proposal by people who make it painfully clear by their arguments that they have absolutely no clue what they're talking about. Of course it would bother me just as much if I were seeing uninformed, flawed arguments in favor of the bailout but I'm not really hearing many of those.

 

And that's the rant I needed to get off my chest.

[direred]

Unfortunately, much of Main Street doesn't actually understand what's going on.

 

There's so much noise on this issue that it's hard to conceive of a plan that would be fair to the people who are trying to keep their homes, fair to those who might be able to be put on plans to restore foreclosed loans, and still keep the banks going.

[hegemony]

I am just curious, how many of the people, who are so dead set against this are against auto industry subsidies, farming subsidies etc.

I am against the auto subsidies and farm subsidies.

[savemanatees]

We are being sold a bill of goods with the promise that it will help Main Street.

Well, Main Street seems to be dead set against it.

BUT, our “betters†will try to ram it through anyway, for OUR benefit, not THEIRS.

WE are apparently self-destructive and incapable of doing what is in OUR best interest.

In fact, THEY have to tell US what we should be doing for our own good.

Last time I checked, this was a free country, and we should be permitted to decide our own destinies.

I, for one, trust Main Street more than Wall Street.

Bob

P.S. No need to respond, I just had to rant.

 

This is the BILL of goods:

 

http://thehill.com/images/stories/graystrip/bill.pdf

 

DITTO on rant

The 76% were heard loud and CLEAR!

 

Happy New Year! (even if you're not Jewish)

[azntg]

Our "betters" are not even trying to disguise their open threats to politicians that are more willing to listen to their constituents (without massive lobbying power).

 

The sign of the times, indeed.

[powers64]

I am just curious, how many of the people, who are so dead set against this are against auto industry subsidies, farming subsidies etc.

I am against the auto subsidies and farm subsidies.

 

 

+1 Especially farm subsidies. We'll never get out from under them. They effect the price of everything we eat.

Edited September 30, 2008 by powers64

[Nikki Nue]

I am just curious, how many of the people, who are so dead set against this are against auto industry subsidies, farming subsidies etc.

Me, for one.

[CIO]

History will show that the big news coming out of this moment in time is not simply about a bailout; but rather that main street finally woke up after decades of being lulled to sleep, flexed its muscle, and said "enough." It was the most welcome sight I've seen in years. It takes painful lessons to get the average person speaking up and out again, and rallying behind a cause. Regardless of this bailout's future, I hope this is the beginning of something grand.

Edited September 30, 2008 by TangMeister

[hdporter]

Hey ... I thought the big news coming out of this moment is that the Washington Capitals have now scheduled their NHL opening game in hell (credit to a TV pundit)

Edited September 30, 2008 by hdporter

[LadyMonteCarlo]

The truth is that we really don't know the truth. We have been fed so many lies for so long many if not most feel we are being lied to once again. The stock market numbers dropping is a scare tactic designed by those demanding the funds.

 

Let's remember that less than 2 weeks ago we were abruptly informed there is a huge crisis and "we" need the nice and neat figure of $700 billion to help things along. Just to help it along not fix the problem. We'll take a blank check and you can't legally review what we are going to do with the money.

 

Our, uh, betters have gotten away with this for so long they really thought it would be that easy. If this weren't an election year they probably would have gotten away with it once again and may still. The timing seems to have worked in the average person's favor, for now. Also, they sure were pushing to get this signed before the end of the fiscal year.

 

However, I think there is something else out there that hasn't reared its head yet. Something that hasn't come out about this bailout and it's failure to pass the house. This actually shutting down for the holiday is wierd too. Especially, if there is such a horrible crisis. Add it all up over the last couple of weeks and none of it makes real sense. There is an absence of real fact.

 

It's tiring to watch the commentators explaining to all of us in elementary terms of how this will effect us if we don't give them the money. We have suddenly gone from being the children to being mom and dad in this country. Once the kids get the money the roles will once again reverse and we will be the same stupid salamanders we were before we gave it to them.

 

This is like your kid coming to you and saying, "Uh, mom you know that car you co-signed for with me? Well if you don't make my car payment your credit going to be messed up cause I can't afford it".

[hegemony]

The truth is that we really don't know the truth.

yuppers. there are known unknowns...

[chriswufgator]

Unfortunately, much of Main Street doesn't actually understand what's going on.

 

That's what I find condescending.

 

Has it ever occurred to everyone that, just perhaps, people DO understand what's going on and STILL are against it?

[Carboran]

Unfortunately, much of Main Street doesn't actually understand what's going on.

 

That's what I find condescending.

 

Has it ever occurred to everyone that, just perhaps, people DO understand what's going on and STILL are against it?

 

Well, considering I have hears statements such as, "why don't they just give the bail-out money to adults, we should all get approx. 250k" and "this will cost each tax payer 500 a month for the next 10 years", I do believe there is a large amount of people who have no idea what they are talking about

[hlburi]

Unfortunately, much of Main Street doesn't actually understand what's going on.

 

That's what I find condescending.

 

Has it ever occurred to everyone that, just perhaps, people DO understand what's going on and STILL are against it?

 

Well, considering I have hears statements such as, "why don't they just give the bail-out money to adults, we should all get approx. 250k" and "this will cost each tax payer 500 a month for the next 10 years", I do believe there is a large amount of people who have no idea what they are talking about

 

That...and the fact that so many people have absolutely no concept how this is going to affect them.

[athensgaguy]

History will show that the big news coming out of this moment in time is not simply about a bailout; but rather that main street finally woke up after decades of being lulled to sleep, flexed its muscle, and said "enough." It was the most welcome sight I've seen in years. It takes painful lessons to get the average person speaking up and out again, and rallying behind a cause. Regardless of this bailout's future, I hope this is the beginning of something grand.

 

I guess it's unfortunate that main street based their opinion on lack of understanding, not that that's unusual.

[athensgaguy]

Unfortunately, much of Main Street doesn't actually understand what's going on.

 

That's what I find condescending.

 

Has it ever occurred to everyone that, just perhaps, people DO understand what's going on and STILL are against it?

 

 

I don't consider myself to be a bastion of superior knowledge, but most people I meet are downright dim.

[chriswufgator]

Unfortunately, much of Main Street doesn't actually understand what's going on.

 

That's what I find condescending.

 

Has it ever occurred to everyone that, just perhaps, people DO understand what's going on and STILL are against it?

 

Well, considering I have hears statements such as, "why don't they just give the bail-out money to adults, we should all get approx. 250k" and "this will cost each tax payer 500 a month for the next 10 years", I do believe there is a large amount of people who have no idea what they are talking about

 

That...and the fact that so many people have absolutely no concept how this is going to affect them.

 

How do you think a failure to pass the bill will affect you?

[chriswufgator]

Unfortunately, much of Main Street doesn't actually understand what's going on.

 

That's what I find condescending.

 

Has it ever occurred to everyone that, just perhaps, people DO understand what's going on and STILL are against it?

 

 

I don't consider myself to be a bastion of superior knowledge, but most people I meet are downright dim.

 

Even dim people can spot an unwanted hand in their pocket.

[hlburi]

Unfortunately, much of Main Street doesn't actually understand what's going on.

 

That's what I find condescending.

 

Has it ever occurred to everyone that, just perhaps, people DO understand what's going on and STILL are against it?

 

Well, considering I have hears statements such as, "why don't they just give the bail-out money to adults, we should all get approx. 250k" and "this will cost each tax payer 500 a month for the next 10 years", I do believe there is a large amount of people who have no idea what they are talking about

 

That...and the fact that so many people have absolutely no concept how this is going to affect them.

 

How do you think a failure to pass the bill will affect you?

 

depends on how long they go without passing it.

 

I don't know how many times I have to keep posting this. I've already posted it several umpteen gazilion times. You either choose to not read it or choose to ignore it.

 

Higher interest rates on loans and credit cards (assuming you can even get them). Prolonged recession will mean more job losses. Businesses will be unable to obtain commercial paper and thus unable to make payrolls.

[chriswufgator]

Unfortunately, much of Main Street doesn't actually understand what's going on.

 

That's what I find condescending.

 

Has it ever occurred to everyone that, just perhaps, people DO understand what's going on and STILL are against it?

 

Well, considering I have hears statements such as, "why don't they just give the bail-out money to adults, we should all get approx. 250k" and "this will cost each tax payer 500 a month for the next 10 years", I do believe there is a large amount of people who have no idea what they are talking about

 

That...and the fact that so many people have absolutely no concept how this is going to affect them.

 

How do you think a failure to pass the bill will affect you?

 

depends on how long they go without passing it.

 

I don't know how many times I have to keep posting this. I've already posted it several umpteen gazilion times. You either choose to not read it or choose to ignore it.

 

Higher interest rates on loans and credit cards (assuming you can even get them). Prolonged recession will mean more job losses. Businesses will be unable to obtain commercial paper and thus unable to make payrolls.

 

But everything you just cited has A: Already happened, it's a fait accompli, and B: Won't be corrected by the government buying mortgage debt anyway.

 

The ONLY possible connection with any of that to the proposed bailout would be that it *might* free up the overnight paper markets, but that seems less likely than not, and there's certainly no guarantee. That approach is kind of like taking your car in for repair, and the mechanic says "Let's just start replacing stuff at your expense, and eventually we'll get to the problem". If the concern is in commercial paper, then the Fed should further open its discount window to non-banks, and accept receivables as collateral. That would be at least a temporary solution to the frozen commercial paper markets.

 

But the current bill does little to nothing to resolve the concerns you have listed.

[MelNYC]

May not be significant, but my morning breakfast place (au bon pain) raised their prices significantly this week here near Wall St and many customers were balking about it this morning.

 

So ... price increases another result? Although I can't figure how they could justify that right now. Gas has dropped.

[hlburi]

the issue is that there needs to be an infusion of cash into the market and it needs to happen rather quickly or things will get worse...

 

armageddon, maybe not... but it won't be pretty

[hlburi]

But everything you just cited has A: Already happened, it's a fait accompli, and B: Won't be corrected by the government buying mortgage :angry:debt anyway.

 

 

and if you believe that what has already happened is going to be the end of it, you are mistaken. That will just be the tip of the iceberg if things are stabilized soon.