Disputing causes 50 point score drop!

[tam5909]

I recently sent in disputes on several negative tradelines that I've disputed previously, but have stuck so far. I got an alert today from EQ score watch that my score dropped 50 points. The accts were already marked "customer disputes this account information" and the only thing that has changed is that there is now a notation stating "reinvestigation in progress." Why would that cause a 50 point drop???

[stickyfingers]

It's crap.

 

When you dispute they update the date on the accounts.

 

So what happened is these were so old they weren't hurting you *much* anymore, and now they're counting as more recent derogs.

 

It's a huge load of crap and I once had my score plummet in just the same manner...

 

[edit: btw...as of yet, I've been unable to get EQ to correctly re-date those TLs, so if anyone has a word there...I'm all ears]

Edited March 16, 2006 by stickyfingers

[tam5909]

It's crap.

 

When you dispute they update the date on the accounts.

 

So what happened is these were so old they weren't hurting you *much* anymore, and now they're counting as more recent derogs.

 

It's a huge load of crap and I once had my score plummet in just the same manner...

 

 

How can they update the date? I mean, is that legal? These things are like 6 years old and due to fall off next year.

[stickyfingers]

It's crap.

 

When you dispute they update the date on the accounts.

 

So what happened is these were so old they weren't hurting you *much* anymore, and now they're counting as more recent derogs.

 

It's a huge load of crap and I once had my score plummet in just the same manner...

 

 

How can they update the date? I mean, is that legal? These things are like 6 years old and due to fall off next year.

IIRC, the DOLA doesn't change. It's the date reported they change and, for whatever reason, that results in a FICO plummet.

 

There's another potential reason they could have dropped. Some folks have posted that disputed TLs get "removed" from the FICO score (I don't think anyone can definitively state that, and I don't buy it). If that's the case, they could have been so old they negatives weren't hurting as much as the age was helping...

 

That's an alternative theory. However, if it's true, then your scores should return to normal if it is verified and that has not been my experience.

[ljmason]

No thats not what happened. Your score dropped because once those accounts are marked in dispute they are no longer factored in your score, therefore the average age of all accounts just took a big hit.

[stickyfingers]

No thats not what happened. Your score dropped because once those accounts are marked in dispute they are no longer factored in your score, therefore the average age of all accounts just took a big hit.

That's based on what information..?

[tam5909]

No thats not what happened. Your score dropped because once those accounts are marked in dispute they are no longer factored in your score, therefore the average age of all accounts just took a big hit.

 

But they were already marked in dispute...the only difference is that they are now noted that a reinvestigation is in progress.

[whadyousay?]

No thats not what happened. Your score dropped because once those accounts are marked in dispute they are no longer factored in your score, therefore the average age of all accounts just took a big hit.

 

I would agree with that because my ficos are 580 576 617 and I have no positive tl's but my bk

in 2000 is on there that is the only thing I can think of for me to even have those scores.

[stickyfingers]

FWIW, (I might have posted this at some other point in time) here's my similiar situation.

 

I disputed 2 collections on EQ (which, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, do not figure into the average age of accounts - they were only collections, regardless though, I think it's moot). When the disputes hit the system, and they were the *only* account change, I also took a 30ish point hit.

 

Both accounts came back verified and my scores stayed at the newly lower level.

 

If it's simply a matter of disputed TLs not factoring in scoring, I should have seen a 30 point bounce back at the end of the dispute which I did not...

 

My $.o2...but, as always, YMMV...

[LKH]

The date reported wouldn't change unless and until it is verified and the investigation is completed.

[stickyfingers]

No thats not what happened. Your score dropped because once those accounts are marked in dispute they are no longer factored in your score, therefore the average age of all accounts just took a big hit.

 

But they were already marked in dispute...the only difference is that they are now noted that a reinvestigation is in progress.

The "marked in dispute" is a seperate issue, I believe.

 

That's a requirement of the furnisher if you've disputed the TL with them (which I imagine you did). Marked in dispute does *not* mean the CRA is investigating it (or, for that matter, has at some point investigated it).

Edited March 16, 2006 by stickyfingers

[LKH]

No thats not what happened. Your score dropped because once those accounts are marked in dispute they are no longer factored in your score, therefore the average age of all accounts just took a big hit.

 

But they were already marked in dispute...the only difference is that they are now noted that a reinvestigation is in progress.

 

How long before the score drop were they marked as under investigation?

[ljmason]

I do believe any acocunt is factored into your average age, however thats weird your scores didnt bouce back at least somewhat. All I can think of is this....

 

When the accounts came back verified, if the creditor re-reported the account as a charge-ff, fico will see it as a brand new chrage off.

 

Does that make sense?

 

 

Maybe its better if I use "graphics....

 

Say you have a charge-off and it reports like this...

 

306090COokokokokokokokokokokokokokokok

 

You dispute it, it gets verified and updated to report like this...

 

306090COokokokokokokokokokokokokokokokCO

 

The dola hasnt been changed however fico will see it as a brand new charge-off.

 

Btw. anyone elses "quote" button not working?

Edited March 16, 2006 by ljmason

[tam5909]

No thats not what happened. Your score dropped because once those accounts are marked in dispute they are no longer factored in your score, therefore the average age of all accounts just took a big hit.

 

But they were already marked in dispute...the only difference is that they are now noted that a reinvestigation is in progress.

 

How long before the score drop were they marked as under investigation?

 

I've been checking my reports daily and they were just marked under investigation yesterday...then, the score drop occurred today. Nothing else changed.

[stickyfingers]

No thats not what happened. Your score dropped because once those accounts are marked in dispute they are no longer factored in your score, therefore the average age of all accounts just took a big hit.

That's based on what information..?

BTW...that was an informational (on my part) not confrontational question.

 

I do see that contention bandied about here often, but I've never seen Fair Isaac state that accounts under investigation no longer count. For me, I'd love to put that one to rest (either way is fine, I'd just like to know for sure).

 

Anyone have a link on that one..?

[ljmason]

I cant "quote" for some reason so this is to stickyfingers. I offer you this...

 

In Oct I applied for a card, denied. Disputed 2 chargeoffs (waited for them to be marked in dispute), fico jumped 50+ pts (they were not old tls, so age wasnt a factor), re-applied and was approved instantly (purely fico drived application process).

[tam5909]

It's crap.

 

When you dispute they update the date on the accounts.

 

So what happened is these were so old they weren't hurting you *much* anymore, and now they're counting as more recent derogs.

 

It's a huge load of crap and I once had my score plummet in just the same manner...

 

 

How can they update the date? I mean, is that legal? These things are like 6 years old and due to fall off next year.

IIRC, the DOLA doesn't change. It's the date reported they change and, for whatever reason, that results in a FICO plummet.

 

There's another potential reason they could have dropped. Some folks have posted that disputed TLs get "removed" from the FICO score (I don't think anyone can definitively state that, and I don't buy it). If that's the case, they could have been so old they negatives weren't hurting as much as the age was helping...

 

That's an alternative theory. However, if it's true, then your scores should return to normal if it is verified and that has not been my experience.

 

 

The other question is...why didn't this happen during my previous disputes?

[LKH]

No thats not what happened. Your score dropped because once those accounts are marked in dispute they are no longer factored in your score, therefore the average age of all accounts just took a big hit.

 

But they were already marked in dispute...the only difference is that they are now noted that a reinvestigation is in progress.

 

How long before the score drop were they marked as under investigation?

 

I've been checking my reports daily and they were just marked under investigation yesterday...then, the score drop occurred today. Nothing else changed.

 

That makes perfect sense to me. Your alert was a little slow in being sent. IMO, what happened is that your accts were marked as in dispute. In the past, and I can't swear it is the same now, accts marked in dispute were not considered in your score. Assuming Efx still operates the same way, those accts being 6 years old and marked as in dispute, lowered your average age of your accts, causing the point loss. If they are deleted, your score will likely stay where it is now, but will increase steadily as time goes by. You're much better off with a lower score and not having those negative accts.

[LKH]

No thats not what happened. Your score dropped because once those accounts are marked in dispute they are no longer factored in your score, therefore the average age of all accounts just took a big hit.

That's based on what information..?

BTW...that was an informational (on my part) not confrontational question.

 

I do see that contention bandied about here often, but I've never seen Fair Isaac state that accounts under investigation no longer count. For me, I'd love to put that one to rest (either way is fine, I'd just like to know for sure).

 

Anyone have a link on that one..?

 

I don't think that is a Fair Isaac deal, I believe Efx is the only cra that doesn't, or at least, didn't, include disputed items in its' scores.

[stickyfingers]

That makes perfect sense to me. Your alert was a little slow in being sent. IMO, what happened is that your accts were marked as in dispute. In the past, and I can't swear it is the same now, accts marked in dispute were not considered in your score. Assuming Efx still operates the same way, those accts being 6 years old and marked as in dispute, lowered your average age of your accts, causing the point loss. If they are deleted, your score will likely stay where it is now, but will increase steadily as time goes by. You're much better off with a lower score and not having those negative accts.

So if they're verified you should see another 50 point increase...

 

Do update this one as I'm interested in this...

 

In my case I did *not* bounce back (though I did get them deleted several weeks later)...

 

Best of luck!

[tam5909]

No thats not what happened. Your score dropped because once those accounts are marked in dispute they are no longer factored in your score, therefore the average age of all accounts just took a big hit.

 

But they were already marked in dispute...the only difference is that they are now noted that a reinvestigation is in progress.

 

How long before the score drop were they marked as under investigation?

 

I've been checking my reports daily and they were just marked under investigation yesterday...then, the score drop occurred today. Nothing else changed.

 

 

That makes perfect sense to me. Your alert was a little slow in being sent. IMO, what happened is that your accts were marked as in dispute. In the past, and I can't swear it is the same now, accts marked in dispute were not considered in your score. Assuming Efx still operates the same way, those accts being 6 years old and marked as in dispute, lowered your average age of your accts, causing the point loss. If they are deleted, your score will likely stay where it is now, but will increase steadily as time goes by. You're much better off with a lower score and not having those negative accts.

 

 

That kind of makes sense...except that they were already noted that I disputed them. From what Stickyfingers said above, that may be viewed differently than the "reinvestiation in progress' notation, so maybe that has something to do with it. But still....there was no score drop before when I disputed, so why now?

[Krisk]

Same thing happened to me. When first I disputed a few accounts with Equifax, the accounts were marked in dispute, and did not lose any points. Then, when I requested re-investigation, I lost about 30 or 40 points.

Later, my score gained about 40 points back but I can’t tell if that was due to a decreased utilization or that re-investigation was complete.

Obviously, when you re-investigate accounts with EQ, you loose points whether that’s permanent or temporary, I don’t know.

[dd1021]

just to add a little more confusion to all of this, my story is about experian. i disputed a judgment (probably 5 years old). as soon as they marked it 'under investigation' i lost 15 points. they ended up deleting it and i never gained any of the points back. so, it had to be the age of the account that caused the drop.

[ecrutch]

I got an alert today from myfico (+7pts). A trade line went from disputed to charge off.

 

 

 

Account opened: 9/2000

Description: Charge off account

Account closed by credit grantor

Charge

 

 

Previously reported Newly reported

Balance: $2,266 $2,266

Past due: $2,266 $2,266

Status: Bad Debt; Placed for collection; Bad Debt; Placed for collection;

Last activity: 11/1/2000 11/1/2000

Description: Consumer disputes - reinvestigation in process Charge off account

Account closed by credit grantor

[stickyfingers]

I got an alert today from myfico (+7pts). A trade line went from disputed to charge off.

 

 

 

Account opened: 9/2000

Description: Charge off account

Account closed by credit grantor

Charge

 

 

Previously reported Newly reported

Balance: $2,266 $2,266

Past due: $2,266 $2,266

Status: Bad Debt; Placed for collection; Bad Debt; Placed for collection;

Last activity: 11/1/2000 11/1/2000

Description: Consumer disputes - reinvestigation in process Charge off account

Account closed by credit grantor

Were you -7 when it went to dispute..? Or was it -<more than 7>..?