I hate to pick on something that might seem minor, but tonight I was extremely embarrassed and inconvenienced at a bar and grill where I went to meet friends. We paid separately, and when the bill came it was under $25 and I had no cash. They informed me that my credit card (MC) could not be used because they have a $25 minimum on all purchases. I had to leave and go to an ATM to pay.

Isn't this a violation of the card agreement? Is there a way I can complain? I feel ill-treated and want to report them -- they deserve it.

**NO MINIMUM CHARGE ON A CREDIT CARD**

NO MAXIMUM CHARGE ON A CREDIT CARD

NO FEE TO USE A CREDIT CARD

NO ID ON A SIGNED CREDIT CARD

its a violation in easy to read terms

REPORT THEM...

Yes, George, thanks. As my post implied, I had some reason to think a $25 minimum is not allowed.

What I'm getting at is: how to I do something about it? who or where do I call? Is there some expectation that the credit card company might take my complaint seriously?

These folks really are a**holes and I'd like to do something about the way I was treated.

The fee is a cost of doing business

"IF" they are at a point of MAKE or BREAK with that small fee...maybe it is time to look for another line of work

I'd call the 800 number on the back of the card, tell them what happened, and ask how you go about filing a complaint that the merchant in question is violating their merchant agreement with MC (i.e "no minimums allowed").

I'm not clear as to whether MC will let you file a complaint over the phone, (as opposed to filling out an online form) but I do know that they want to hear from cardholders when merchants attempt to impose purchase minimums, as that's a total no-no where Visa/MC are concerned (and AMEX, too, I believe).

Was it a VISA or MC

Report those bastards, sounds like a civil discrimination case to me, all the duress and emotional distress it caused you as you were ridiculed in front of your fellow colleagues....

Just one of the reasons I carry the credit card policy in my wallet

I keep it in the place "SOME" carry that EXPENSIVE CASH

Is it laminated?


OP, file a complaint with Visa/MC and bar mgmt.

Thanks for the helpful reply. Look, I'm not a crank. My initial post said that I hate to make an issue out of something that might seem minor.

But, you know what? I had to pay over $5.00 for an out-of-network ATM withdrawal, and the people were not nice.

Whatever.

ADD THE EXTRA FEE TO THE COMPLAINT

They may refund it to you (INCLUDING THE FEE) and add it to the fine they give the business

REPEAT OFFENDERS CAN BE FINED $1,000's

I am a civil suit fanatic. A five dollar fee and walking my fat @ss over to atm would piss me off severely. I would at least call and request a 5.00 reimbursement; maybe visa will give it to you. Cheap bastards, 25 dollar minimum.... how lame.

Good luck with whatever action you choose.

OP, what's the name of this establishment? I hope you didn't leave a tip!

VISA: 1-800-VISA-911
MasterCard: 1-800-300-3069


Also easily report merchant violations online:

http://www.mastercard.com/us/personal/en/c...violations.html

Check the box that says "Merchant required ID"

I (many times have collected the cash from everybody else) THEN USED MY CREDIT CARD TO PAY FOR EVERYBODY's BILL

I just deposit the cash in the bank

I got miles for all that cash

Sad part is...somebody is a little short for the TAX PART (and always the TIP)

Regarding the ID thing, some states have passed laws that actually make it legal for them to ask you for ID (which is stupid, because it takes a potential case of CC fraud, which is bad, and turns it into a potential case of identity theft, which is VERY BAD). I know my state (Washington) does (grumble)

http://www.komonews.com/news/archive/4191886.html

But yeah, can't have minimums. If its local teriyaki shop I know they're violating rules but I like em and use cash or let them add $.50 on or whatever. If they're mean about it, they get reported (or if its like a starbucks)

I would be really mad, but I think you handled the situation very well. I can guarantee it would have been a million times more embarrassing to you and your friends if you had decided to make a big scene.

If I were you, I would write a formal letter of complaint to the highest level of management. Tell them that the staff made you feel like dirt. Even though they were doing their job by enforcing company policy, they didn't uphold their job to provide good customer service. Don't threaten them, but do remind them that they violated the CC merchant agreement.

I work in the restaurant industry, and this type of letter should be able to get you your $5 back many times over in the form of gift certificates and coupons. (You may even be able to get your original bill refunded depending on their reaction.)

If the restaurant is a jerk to you after your letter, then complain directly to MC.

That link you gave doesn't concern merchants asking for ID per se, it has to do with idiots who insist on signing their cards "SEE ID" rather than with their actual signature.

If you don't sign the card, the merchant has nothing to compare the signature on the charge slip with. In which case, they can (according to your article) ask for ID.

You're confusing the above with folks who do sign their card on the back (the way they're supposed to) and yet are asked for ID anyway. While a merchant has the right to ask for ID, they cannot make it a condition of card acceptance (at least with Visa/MC). IOW: they have the right to ask for ID, but they still have to process the transaction if the card is signed and isn't expired (and the signature on the charge slip is at least somewhat similar to the one on the back of the card).

Apologies: I missed the second line in that article and only caught it on a re-read. Sorry about that.

I must say that Washington lawmakers are pretty misguided if they think that allowing merchants to ask for ID prevents fraud in any sort of meaningful way. If I understand correctly, the vast majority of CC fraud happens when a given card is skimmed and the magstripe data is used to fashion a whole new card. After all, you don't want the original cardholder to report their card has been lost or stolen before you use their card data to buy a plasma TV, do you?

I think the card companies know that merchants asking customers for ID won't put any real dent into CC fraud. Which is why they don't require merchants to ask for ID to process card transactions.

I probably would have just informed them they are not allowed to do that per Visa/MC rules, and mentioned they post signs stating they accept Visa/MC, and then just said "what's wrong with my money? is it not good enough for you?" If they insisted on cash I'd walk out without paying. (Hey, you tried! They refused your money, so what else can you do? I wouldn't just give in and walk to an ATM.)

Let them charge you the fee and get a chargeback of .50.

"They wrongfully charged a credit card fee."

I wonder if they would have taken your card if you made a bigger deal about it...

like take my credit card or nothing... make it loud and clear that you want to pay by credit card and the business wont take it. If they still wont, say call the the cops. Continue to say your willing to pay by your credit card... when the cops come, they slap the business for not taking your credit card and calling them. Cops know this no min law but will think its dumb that the business just didn't take your card but now the business has your name & CC number... sigh.

now if your in some hick down where the business owner knows the cops... well you might spend a night in jail before it gets all sorted out but then you got a lawsuit... depends how far you want to push your luck... ha ha

bottom line, always carry a little cash & places that have mins, vote with your $ and don't do business with them.

You would have been really embarrassed if they called the police when you left to go to the ATM.

I do this specifically because groups tend to be short on tips - especially if its a place we go often, i don't want the waitstaff to get stiffed so i collect the cash and pay on my biz card... then write it off as a biz expense. I get the rewards for throwing in more than my fair share.

I wouldn't waste the cops time for this - you could end up in more trouble than its worth. Cops will tell you to get cash and pay... maybe even escort you to the ATM and back.

Thanks for all of the information. I went ahead and made an online complaint to Mastercard based on the $25 minimum and their asking to see ID. I also asked reimbursement for the ATM fees, though I won't hold my breath on that.

I already talked politely to their manager -- it is not a chain restaurant. He was the one who was most dismissive and rude.

It['s a local place -- I'm hoping MC does not pass on my name in the complaint. But I'm willing to take the consequences if they do tell the merchant my name.

I hope this goes somewhere. The auto-generated e-mail reply stated that MC does not guarantee that they will get back to complainants on status.

I would hope they would pass my name on the complaint list so the manager knows it was me just to throw it in his face. Id also go back and see if they try that crap again and if so file ANOTHER complaint and make sure you tell them that is your intent. If they want to break the rules they can do without accepting the cards.

It costs the city money to send cops out, and you want to waste their time on something like this--just so you can prove a point to a lousy merchant?

Anyway, what makes this situation ridiculous is that the minimum is $25. If it were $5 or $10, I can see their reluctance to incur transaction fees. It makes me wonder if maybe they have some arrangement with the institution that runs the ATM so that they get a cut of the ATM fees. They must send A LOT of customers over there. That the restaurant manager was a jerk to the OP implies that he's had to deal with this situation many times.

I was recently asked to provide a photo ID with my Visa credit card and I was bothered by it because i don't waant a cashier looking at all of my personal info on my drivers liscence and then having all of my credit card info too. I called my bank about it and they said that the old signature on the back of the card is not the standard anymore. Merchants now have the right to protect themselves and ask for additional verification beyond the signature on the back of the card.

This is a new world in credit. banks don't care about the merchants they care about protecting themselves against fraud.

The people at your bank are wrong. Technically, it is still the approved standard. Unfortunately, and amazingly, this misinformation is not uncommon with banks and even low-level CSRs at VISA and MC themselves.

I really am not so sure about that now because i spoke with the store manager about this and he said Visa/MC advised him to follow a photo ID verification process because of a sharp increase in fraud.

I extremely doubt that. I would want proof that Visa/MC allowed that.

Crooked manager was simply lying to you to get you to shut-up and give-up your ID. Obviously it is a major security and identity theft risk, extreme invasion of privacy, and a no-brainer to keep your ID to yourself. No reasonable adult would hand over their ID to some violating cashier on demand. The most important thing is making sure it never happens again, so if any violating merchant should ever pop-up in your community, make sure they are eliminated/brought back into line immediately - 1-800-VISA-911.

CREDIT CARD SIGNATURE IS ALL THE ID NEEDED

When you pay for merchandise with a Visa card, MasterCard, or American Express any store that accepts these cards should accept yours too, no questions asked. It's part of the deal that merchants agree to when they become participating members.

They must check your signature and the card - electronically or by telephone - to be sure it's valid. Once the answer comes up yes, they can go ahead and charge. They can't ask you for any further identification - not a license plate number, Social Security number, proof of address, phone number or photo ID.

Your personal ID isn't needed because Visa, MasterCard, and American Express all guarantee payment on cards that have been properly checked. If the issuer mistakenly authorizes a sale on a bad card, it should make good. MasterCard says that merchants receive instant settlement. The contract MasterCard merchants sign specifically prevents them from asking for personal ID.

Unfortunately, not all merchants play by the rules. Some, apparently, haven't read them.

WHAT YOU CAN DO

MasterCard wants to hear about merchants who break their rules. Send the name and address and an account of what happened to MasterCard WorldWide 2000 Purchase St. Purchase, NY 10577 or call 1-800-300-3069. The merchant's bank will get a stiff letter, ordering it to investigate and bring the offending store into line - or pay a $2,000 fine. You may also report violations online:

http://www.mastercard.com/us/personal/en/c...violations.html

Visa enforces the same rules as MasterCard. "When we hear about a violation, we ask the bank that signed the merchant to get together with the merchant and see that the practice is stopped," Visa representative states. To report a merchant, send a letter to the bank that that issued your Visa card or call 1-800-VISA-911.

American Express also prohibits merchants from asking for IDs. "All a merchant is supposed to do is take an imprint, make sure the signature matches and swipe the card through the terminal, to get authorization."

THE SIGNATURE ON THE BACK OF THE CARD IS THE ID

Unless you are one of those fools who don't sign their card or put CID

CID is not your name

You can be held liable for FRAUD w/o a signature on your credit card

Either he lied to you... thinking you had no way to prove otherwise... or they gave him incorrect advice.

The NO ID for signed cards in not my policy

Had the credit card companies expected the business to require ID...why have a signature strip

The whole checking id thing is just a pathetic waste of time. The cashier or bartender or whomever is no more an expert in facial recognition than they are in handwriting analysis. (I chuckle when clerks scrutinize my signature, like they could detect a decent forgery.)

Case in point (not credit-related): a local woman here "borrowed" a former colleague's driver's license.

She then used the other woman's DL as id when buying tickets at Phila Intl Airport for herself and her 9yo daughter, AFTER calling 911 and saying they had been abducted and locked in the trunk of a car. FBI and other LEOs / Amber Alert / media frenzy ensued.

Now everybody on the news is asking why the ticket counter/TSA folks didn't notice it wasn't her face on the DL. (There was a resemblance.)

http://www.philly.com/philly/news/breaking...ce_charges.html

Yeah I'm with you. It opens you up to identity theft (a lot of people think CC fraud is Identity Theft, totally different sport). Plus yeah most CC fraud is with skimmed cards or on the internet. Washington lawmakers misguided, thats not even the 1/8th of it




I could, but if they're local teriyaki shop I dont mind

How annoying!! For M/C there is an on-line form and Visa you can call 1-800-visa911 and ask to make an incident report. I would definately report them to both companies. It's a bit of a hassle to take the time to deal with these reports, but how much of a hassle was it to get up and go to an ATM and pay to get cash. If no one ever reports them they have no incentive to learn and change their policies. I would absolutely take it up with the manager/owner and make sure I got a free meal AND my $5 back.

I don't have any way to get any money out of an ATM

They would take the credit card or COMP THE PURCHASE

Jolty: Your bank lied to you and the manager lied to you.

This though is precisely how this ID practice spreads.

File some reports. MasterCard is 1-800-300-3069 and Visa is 1-800-Visa-911. If you want to write letters, I can get you the addresses. Make sure that you make it clear that the store REQUIRES ID (not "requests" or "asks for") when filing the report.

Have you guys ever though that maybe the merchant did not lie and was either told by his bank or his merchant provide to check id?

Maybe the merchant itself was getting to many chargebacks.

The merchant will NEVER be told by their bank to check ID. Even if they get too many chargebacks (6% over a certain time period), they go under a monitoring program. If it is bad enough, they can gain approval for zip code requirement for all Visa transactions (and possibly MC).

I am not trying to be rude, I do have some grammar problems.

Are you sure? From reading here and other places. Banks have told customers it is ok for the merchants to check id. My bank told me the same thing (yes, I know it violates Mastercard and Visa Policy). If a customer is told that, I wouldnt be surprised if a merchant is told that.

The policy is set...NO ID ON A SIGNED CREDIT CARD...period

The business doesn't get to make the rules

Post #38.



How do you know that?

I've been told by VISA CSRs that ID checking was perfectly acceptable when I called to do an incident report. I had to educate them. There are many similar stories in this forum where bank employees don;t know the rules and give some easy (and uninformed) answer just to get rid of the complaining customer.

Wow, you guys won't believe this. As I mentioned, I work at a restaurant. Tonight a lady handed me the folder with the bill and her payment. She was immersed in her conversation, so I quietly took the folder and went to handle the payment. The folder contained both her driver's license and BoA card. The card was unsigned, no "See ID" or anything. I guess she's used to presenting her ID to people because of her unsigned card. What I can't get over is that she handed me her drivers license simply assuming that I would want to see it. I had her full name, DOB, and address right there along with her CC.

I thought about saying something to her about it, but I don't think she would have taken me seriously.