Frisbee

When Canes was originally diagnosed his primary concern was his family. He understood the battle he was facing and fought bravely, didn't complain and remained optimistic. His legacy here is all of us who have better lives because of his knowledge, helpful spirit and wit. Rest well my friend. May your family find peace and comfort knowing how many "strangers" were touched by your life. FRIZ

You do nothing as far as contacting them. What you must do: 1. LEARN....www.whychat.5u.com. read up on repo 2. www.lawdog.com click you state next page click secured credit (not repo) read how a legal repo goes down and make a note of the statute numbers. 3. google the state statute numbers and go read them This is a UCC article 9 issue. (uniform commerical code) Any secured debt is covered under the UCC. The statute is 4 years...period the END!! The secured debt section of the article 9 is under the sections 500-700's. You must learn these. It's Greek at first, but if you print them out and go over them a few times, it will click in. The gist of it is: 1. you had a repo 2. the written contract was perfected upon that act. (ends the arugment for SOL written contract) because the act of the repo perfected (ended) the terms of that contract. 3. you then entered the bonus round. Under the bonus round they obtained possesion of the vehicle. That forced them by law to do certain things. a. notify you in writing they had the vehicle b. they would sell it if you didn't pay off the loan balance (most states), where/when/how they would sell c. then they owed you a letter telling you how much the deficency balance was post sale. THIS is where the UCC 4 year SOL started...at the sale date. WHY? because the contract was perfected BUTTTT you now had a "new" balance owed to them via the deficiency balance. 4 YEARS ONLY TO COLLECT STARTING ON THE SALE DATE. 4. You need to get everything in a file and stay organized. Just because this is SOL doesn't mean you can't be sued until the end of days. HOWEVER you will have the affirmative defense of it being past SOL and you will whip out your file and WIN in ANY court of law! To everyone (hi Philly!!!) who helped you out here....nice work group!!! I'm semi retired and I knew you would all do fine w/o me. Seriously OP...Katz is a bad bunch. They have nothing but threats to hold over you. Never speak with them again. They have nothing to offer you but misery. Good luck and again to everyone here....nice job!

Unbelievable! You have that letter I told you to keep right? It clearly proves this alleged account is SOL. What I want to know is why did they attempt to serve you at your parents home? You d/v'd them. They send you "validation". WHAT address did they correspond with you? Was it your parents home????? If not, then clearly they are trying to get an easy default against you. You had better check the court docket in your parents county to see what's up. www.naca.net has 4 lawyers listed. You need to find out what's up with that summons. Don't let them use an alternate method of service, like publication to win this case behind your back. You clearly have the affirmative defense of SOL. You will win this case if you find out about it before they get a default.

You can sign it because you are dealing with the original creditor. I do think it is a delaying tactic. I've never seen them do this before.

Ok, so it was you who woke up the giant. Listen, they KNOW and CU should know, that this repo was not done according to law. Believe me when I tell you that the postal system in this country works just fine. Mail forwarding is routine. IFFFF they had sent you the legally required notices you would have rec'd them. Your options now are: duck and hide and hope they go away continue to poke them and DEMAND copies of all the notices they sent. go to:www.whychat.5u.com there is great repo info there including the repo/def letter. I wouldn't suggest sending it out right away, rather learn the law and figure out what they blew. PUll the carfax for that vehicle. Get your records in order in case they rachet up attempts to collect. At that point hit them hard and demand proof of claim.

Frankly, I didn't read the laws of your state...just skimmed them for you. However, most states do NOT require CMRRR. If you were out of state, what happened to your mail? Was it forwarded? They don't get to put the onus on you to prove you received the notices. The onus (and law) is on them to give you alllll the notices required. I'm pretty sure you are dealing with a CU....correct? I'll tell you this much, CU's sue...period the end. They sue because they need to protect their memebers. I can also tell you from many posts here, that many, many credit unions do not follow the UCC when it comes to repo law. It's unusual that a CU didn't contact you immediately post repo to collect a def. balance. Makes me wonder........

CU Recovery is a collection agency for credit unions. They aren't especially aggressive and if you check their website you'll get a good flavor for them. There used to be a place on their site that explained that they collected repos done with all proper notification. I don't see it there anymore. The thing is that they are fully aware of what is and what isn't a proper repo under the UCC. http://le.utah.gov/~code/TITLE70A/70A09a.htm Start reading in the 600's. You'll get the laws for a legal repo there. IF you rec'd no notification, you've had an improper repo. Frankly, you haven't given me much to work with here. I think if you follow the link I gave, you'll be ok. As to disputing a repo under 2 years, wellll, that's up to you. You'd be better off learning the laws, knowing which ones were not obeyed and getting you ducks in a row.

There are many threads here about Paul Law Office. http://creditboards.com/forums/index.php?s...;paul+law\ There are some other threads in that thread. On top of this page is a "search" feature. Use it to find more threads. Search this way: "Paul Law"

Section 808(8) prohibits showing anything other than the debt collector's address, on any envelope in any written communication to the consumer, except that a debt collector may use his business name if it does not indicate that he is in the debt collection business. 1. Business names prohibited on envelopes. A debt collector may not put on his envelope any business name with "debt" or "collector" in it, or any other name that indicates he is in the debt collection business. A debt collector may not use the American Collectors Association logo on an envelope. 2. Collector's name. Whether a debt collector/consumer reporting agency's use of his own "credit bureau" or other name indicates that he is in the collection business, and thus violates the section, is a factual issue to be determined in each individual case. 3. Harmless words or symbols. A debt collector does not violate this section by using an envelope printed with words or notations that do not suggest the purpose of the communication. For example, a collector may communicate via an actual telegram or similar service that uses a Western Union (or other provider) logo and the word "telegram" (or similar word) on the envelope, or a letter with the word "Personal" or "Confidential" on the envelope. 4. Transparent envelopes. A debt collector may not use a transparent envelope, which reveals language or symbols indicating his debt collection business, because it is the equivalent of putting information on an envelope.

OK - I just re-read this last paragraph - I definately have not had the vehicle for 4 years. So, if I can prove that I have not had this vehicle for 4 years - do I send Wells Fargo a letter telling them that it is past SOL with proof such as the Carfax report and my insurance policy showing the vehicle was dropped? Only have one minute then gone for a while. http://www.whychat.5u.com/repoltr.html that's what you send when you understand I'd also make sure to let them know that the letter you rec'd was the FIRST communication EVER. Good luck. I'll be back next week. Oh, state law doesn't matter too much. The UCC means the states all fashion their laws on secured debt in a "union" fashion. Google them all. you always need article 9 ... secured debt ... usually it's like 9-501 thru the 700's.

Owner 2 Purchased: 2002 Type: Personal Where: Indiana Est. miles/year: --- Est. length owned: 10/7/02 - 7/10/05 (2 yrs. 9 mo.) This is really, really important. Did you still have that vehicle July 10, 2005? I don't think you did. When did you stop (exactly) making payments and when did you remove the insurance from this vehicle? Do you have records to support those claims???? The longer you can prove you did not have this vehicle (did repo guy give you receipt) the stronger your case is. Notice that this vehicle was not resold until Jan 06. We want as much time between them having it and reselling it. It's a depreciating asset. The longer they kept it, the less it was worth. No judge will find 8 months or so to be reasonable, let alone commercially reasonable as required by law. To another poster: voluntary repo....yes, covered under UCC. The repo itself perfects the your written contract. The reselling (auction) of the vehicle created a deficiency balance. THAT balance become (for lack of better term) a new "arrangement". The clock for the UCC 4 year SOL starts there. To another poster: Yes, I'm sure the UCC covers a repo and NOT written contract law.....as long as....they did repo the vehicle and resell it and you still don't have it. I'm taking some time off. I'll try to catch up with this thread. Warning again to OP: WF likes to sue. Watch your back. Do not talk to anybody about this. Go to www.whychat.5u. com. Learn Go to lawdog.com click on your state next page click on secured debt...not repo next page get a snapshot of repo law for you and stat numbers. Google the stats. Learn fast. That July 05 date is an issue. We need this to be past 4 years. IF you can prove you didn't have it more then 4 years ago and that they held off the sale past a point of reasonable, you win. The other ways to attack are lack of notices, but the strongest case is a simple SOL with a non commercial reasonable on the side.

Please...stay with this thread. I hate crossing threads when new info comes up. The UCC is 4 year SOL. Lack of notices gives you wiggle room at a minimum to defeat them. Holding the car that long (I am understanding you correctly, yes?) is NOT commercially reasonable. That one thing alone will make this all go poof. Watch your back. WF can be a tough act. I do NOT like them claiming to have tried to contact you previously. When you write them make them aware that you aren't buying into that claim. "I am writing concerning a letter I rec'd from your company dated xxxx. This is the first communication I have rec'd from your company." Like that....

Let me cut to the chase: IF these Bozo's repo'd the vehicle (est. late April 2004) and didn't auction it until (according to you 8 months) Dec 04, there isn't a court anywhere that would find that sale to be commercially reasonable. PLEASE tell me you have that vin number. Run a carfax and check auction date. Anything past 6 months(which is very long) is going to cancel this debt.

We never received anything from them - in fact, they couldn't even find the car for 8+ months. We called and made arrangements for the repo company to pick it up and they didn't know where it was for 8 months. Did you ever hear from them during the period of time post repo and pre-b/k???? We never received anything from them. Ok, hold on. Are you saying that the repo company WF told you to contact, picked up the vehicle and then the vehicle was missing??????? Oh, this is toooo good. Sounds to me like WF totally fell asleep at the switch. More details needed.

Assuming you received all the legally required notices (www.whychat.5u.com) under the UCC article 9, oh, yeah, leave it alone. This is with the OC and they have the paperwork to make your life a misery.