BrokeIn2011

Long story short, I have about 41K worth of business credit card debt (with Wells Fargo Bank) which I signed to personal guarantee for back in 2002. My business closed due to the economy in June 2010, and I have no way to pay the debt. It appears that Wells Fargo sold the debt, when I got only 2 collection letters (just one month apart) from a collection company in Arizona (in February and March of 2011). Then last November, I get a collection letter from a collection company in California, for this debt. On December 13, 2011 I sent a certified request for a Debt Validation Letter (DVL) to that collection company (with a 30 day demand for them to answer or give up rights to collect the debt) requesting documented proof that I signed a personal guarantee, provide copies of documentation and or proof that I accumulated this debt, along with asking (who, when, date) how they acquired this debt. Then on December 16th, I received my delivery confirmation of my certified letter, and I also received a certified letter from the collection company (on the same day) with their answer to my DVL. They only provided me with a one page (invoice looking) document that only contains basic information of the original creditor (name, address, account number, date opened, owed amount $40,564.40). Though I had a separate business billing address, this collector listed my home address as my billing address in their letter. So on December 22nd, I just sent a 2nd Debt validation letter request (yet I just mailed it in the regular mail instead of spending almost $6 to have the letter sent certified), with a 30 day demand for them to answer or give up rights to collect the debt), with a request for them to provide me with documented copies of all proofs that I owe the debt. In that letter, I basically stated that I received their answer to my DVL, but they did not provide any copies or documented proof that I guaranteed the debt and nor did they provide any documents or proof that I made any purchases on the account and nor did they provide me with copies or proof that I owe this debt. So there is no way to determine if the debt is mine. On a side note, their DVL looks more like a "here say" letter, just as their original collection letter does . . . with no documented copies of any proof that I owe the debt. Since this was my first time requesting a DVL, I really did not know what to expect from the collector, however I think that it would be reasonable that they should at least provide me with at least a few documents that showed that I signed a PG and that I signed/charged items to this account to accumulate the debt. What really should I have received from the creditor in my DVL? Is this all required by law for them to send me? I know that if they severed me a summons and I answered it, they would have to show documented proof that I owe what they would be suing for . . . yet since this has not turned into a lawsuit as of yet, I am surprised they did/will not provide me with any type of copies of any documentation that this is my debt. Now that it is January 10, 2012, I have not heard anything from the collector. Should I be concerned or should I send them a certified letter of the second letter I sent to them, giving them one final chance to come up with the information and copies of the documentation I requested? Since they answered my first DVL within 48 hours of receiving it, I thought sure that they would have answered my second DVL with copies of the documentation that I requested, to prove the validity of the debt they are trying to collect from me.

Thank you both Jon77, and Sanscrit. I greatly appreciate your help.

Awhile back, I has seen in this forum or another forum, a sample letter to send to a creditor or collector to find out what I owe and what proof do they have that I owe this debt. However I can not seem to find it at the moment. Can someone please post the link to that thread. Thank you.

Thank you very much Flacorps, Direct, and Alplouis. I greatly appreciate you taking the time to look over my issue, and I sincerely appreciate you all being most kind to offer me your advice. Based on the wealth of great information that you 3 have provided, it will take me a few days to digest it all and then try to decide what my next move will be. The business line of credit was issued by Wells Fargo bank and the debt is now with a company called “Investment Retrievers” in Eldorado Hills, California. The first collector from Phoenix, Arizona is a company called "Primary Financial Services". Any idea what rating do these two collection companies fall into (i.e. top tier or bottom tier collector)? Thanks a MILLION, you 3!!! Most of all, thank you for listening.

June 2010, my business failed. I had a 40K bank line of credit I defaulted on. I got tons of collection calls from the bank until February 11. In February and March I got one collection letter each month for this loan via a non-bank collection company in Arizona. Then I never heard any more from the bank or the Arizona collection company. Then from September until this past Monday, I received about one call per week from another non-bank collection company on this loan. This time from a new collection company in California. But I never returned the calls. Then late last week, I received my first collection letter from the California company letting me know that they are trying to collect 45K from me on this bank line of credit. So they said in their letter since they have been unable to reach me by phone, that I have to call them to try to work out a resolution, but they have forwarded my account to their legal council. Yet they provided not deadline date for me to contact them. Yet one haunting thing about the California company's phone calls was they kept making a reference that they located me at my home address and that they see that I have the house in my name. Then on Monday, the lady that always calls and leaves a message, had a very, very happy tone in her voice as she left the message . . . as if to say, this is the last time I have to call you, because they are going to take the collection to court. I would like to see if there is a way I can work out a resolution for this business loan, but I am not quite sure if it is a good idea to telephone them, like their letter wants me to. Yet it may be too late. It sounds like in their letter, that they can take this matter to the court and have a judgment ruled in their favor and they can start seizing assets and property, without ever serving me a summons, and as if this letter is their final communication to me and whatever legal action they take, I will not be included on it and that basically the next thing that will happen, the sheriff will be at my door with the judgment for them to instantly start seizing assets and property. Can this be done, even if it is a business loan judgment? I doubt if I can file a business bankruptcy on this, since I personal guaranteed the line of credit I borrow. Yet right now, it is doubtful that I could pay back 45K in a timely manner, to satisfy them. Yet I feel if I at least make contact with these people, it may slow things down to see if I can try to pay them back or file business bankruptcy. I am sure it doesn't matter, but looking at the envelope, the letter, the return P.O. Box address, it looks like this collector is one of those types of businesses that somebody is running from their kitchen table. Yet they have a very impressive website, that announces "A leader in debt acquisition and debt management.", yet they do not list the physical location of the business on their website, they only list the P.O. Box. I really would sincerely like to try to pay this loan somehow, but I have fallen on very bad times, like a great deal of small businesses out there, due to our very poor economy over the past 2 years.

Thanks Jonson, and Mca. With our rotten & stinking economy, I am sure that one day (minus credit unions), that all checking accounts with a bank or savings and loan (S&L) will have a fee, if you don’t qualify for one of their catchs . . . i.e. you need to have a minimum balance or you need to have direct deposit or you need to have at least another account in their financial institution with a minimum balance in that account. Back in the 80's, I had a checking account with a S&L, yet in order to get a fee free checking account with them, I had a 5 year 5K CD. So I was able to escape that dreaded fee for at least 5 years. Am I dating myself if I say . . . I remember when banks used to give you free stuff just for opening a checking account. Free stuff like toasters, coffee makers, toaster ovens, cheap piggy banks, etc. “Ah the good old days.” GASP!!! Did I just say that out loud? LOL!!! COOL website by the way, Mca.

Thank you very much Jonson, I appreciate you doing some homework to try to help me. Yet overall, I am not surprised that I finally got hit with this account maintenance free, since I had been hearing for well over a year, that more and more financial institutions were starting to implement checking account maintenance fees, whereas their checking accounts were fee free for years. Yet I will look into the details of getting a Silver Checking Package to see if I can do as you suggested (setup an automatic transfer to a savings account of $25 or more. So that it is setup to automatically transfer $25 to the savings, then just transfer it back to the checking. ) Thanks a MILLION!

Thank you very much ArchonInitiative, and Bullthistle. I greatly appreciate your input, help, and suggestions. I live in Los Angeles, however I do not live near a Walmart. So I really can’t use Walmart as an option per se, because the closest one to me, is about 15 miles away. Since I do not have any other business dealings in or near the area where Walmart is located, I would end up burning up time and gas to do a round trip to Walmart. For sure, I will look into PNC Bank. The checking account that I am crying over is US Bank. I have had this checking account with them for over 10 years, but just this month is when they started hitting me with a $9 monthly service fee. MAJOR FROWN!!! Out of curiosity ArchonInitiative, do you know if banks use ChexSystems for a “savings account”? Since my credit report is fried, I am not sure would a bank deny opening up a savings account. Since I do not now if a banks screens a potential customer a different way to open a savings account vs. a checking account. Yet that is a good idea about having a savings account and just use a debit/ATM card (with a Visa or MasterCard logo). So I am wondering if getting a savings account with a debit/ATM card is much easier than the pain of having your credit report pulled and dealing with ChexSystems in order to open a checking account? For now, I will do what I can to hold onto this checking account. Hopefully my work will pick up and the $9 monthly account fee will one day be not so hard on me. Bullthistle, how would I check ChexSystems on my own, without a bank doing it? If it is possible to check ChexSystems on my own while saving me the embarrassment of having a bank turn me down in-person while trying to open a checking account, that would be great to know what ChexSystems say’s about me first. Yet I will kept that option open in regards to opening a checking account at the Woodforest Branch inside of Walmart. Thanks very much you two! I greatly appreciate it.

Due to the current economy, I fell behind in about 95% of my bills, starting spring of last year, due to being unemployed and not being eligible for unemployment insurance. Before my financial troubles started in spring of last year, I had a 730 FICO score, but now my FICO score is in the dumps (below 500). I have managed to keep a checking account during my current turmoil, however just this month, my bank is now charging me $9 per month for a checking account. So now I have to try to get a new checking account. Since I am underemployed, where I only am able to find about 5 hours of work per week, needless to say, $9 a month is a hardship for me to pay. Yet I know that every time you open a checking account, they will do a credit check. Though I do not have any bounced checks to my name, I am just wondering if I go to a bank that still has free checking, will they decline to open a checking account for me? Also, over the past 12 months, I have had 4 checking accounts closed (closed by the bank), due to the fact that I was unable to keep a balance in any of them to cover the monthly account fee (3 were business checking accounts, and one account was a personal checking account), yet I never bounced any checks on these accounts, however along the way, there came a day where there was insufficient funds in the accounts to cover the monthly account maintenance fee . . . so the banks closed the accounts after several months of me ignoring their letters.

Thanks Settle, will do! Thank you for the help ArchonInitiative, and Cprems. Yet again, in my case, there is absolutely no business debt. The only debt is just my own personal debt. My business operated on a very low overhead, so I was able to keep up on all of that debt until I closed my doors. So at least I do not have to worry about any business debt. Thanks again Everyone for your continued help and support. It is greatly appreciated!

Though my credit report is toast , yet on a regular basis I see various online ads from either Capital One and American Express stating that you can apply for their credit card online AND you can get an answer as to if they will approve you or not in 60 seconds. Since I have very bad credit, I never investigated or tried my luck doing one of these online applications, yet I just was curious as to how they can do approvals or denials so quick. Yet back in the days when my credit was good, I do recall reading in some online credit forums where people were initially approved online, yet while these approved people were waiting for their credit card to arrive in the mail, they ended up getting a denial letter, because the credit card company soon discovered that that person’s credit was too bad. Yet I was just curious as to if anyone in this forum with “current bad credit” was able to successfully get approved online for a credit card (that later arrived in the mail), without the credit card company coming along later to close the account because something happened where they soon discovered that your credit was bad or too bad and that they should not have originally approved and or issued you a credit card in the first place? I am guessing that initially you must supply so much information in the online application where a computer does a preliminary acceptance or denial of credit, but soon (within several days) a real person sits down and makes the ultimate decision if credit will be granted or not, regardless of what the computer approved. Yet maybe this is just all a game for the credit card companies to see if they can get some new customers by having the 60 second approval/denial process online ads . . . whereas otherwise, people would not bother contacting these credit card companies on their own I guess.

Thank you! Thank you! I appreciate your help and support, iWhat, and Cprems. I will keep you posted.

Thank you Clambert1273, Cprems, and Banditone. I greatly appreciate the additional feedback, advice, and help. For sure, what you have shared gives me food for thought and gives me good information to discuss with the BK lawyers. Thanks so very, very much!

Thanks once again Jaymes, and PunisherSD. I sincerely thank you for taking the time to provide your input to my question. Since this is my first time reaching out for help on this, I did not know that one of the possible solutions would be filing BK. Yet seeing the serious of this matter, I will search for a BK lawyer in the next few days. Cprems, thank you for your help. In this case, all of my debt is personal debt and not business debt. I should have made that clear in my first posting, however I did not realize that I should have stated that until you brought it to my attention, and I now do see how it can be confusing since I stated that information about having to close my business and my having about 100K of credit card debt. However I am being sued personally. :cry2:I apologize for the confusion.

Thank you PunisherSD, Dr. Dolemite, and Jaymes. I greatly appreciate your help, advice, and suggestions. Jaymes, thank you for providing such a very detailed and very useful reply. What you have shared I think really will help me in both the “short” and “long” run. Thanks a MILLION you three!