16 replies to this topic

[LizaW]

I started this round of repair before I was aware of the HIPAA process, and I'm still having trouble following why chat's website, it gets kinda confusing.

Interestingly this company is reporting this as an "open" revolving account on TU.

Here's what's happened so far:
5/1/2012-- Wrote the OC CMRRR pointing out that they had violated our contract, had failed to provide the services being billed, that I revoked my HIPAA disclosure authorization, demanded they turn no more info over to any CA since there was no business purpose given that we were in negotiations to resolve, and finally offered a PFD based on partial payment. Sent this to the "HIPAA Compliance Officer"
5/1/2012-- Wrote CMRRR all three CRAs asking for verification of debt listed by "Medical Data Systems" (this company uses so many names, designed to confuse I'm sure.)
5/1/2012-- Wrote CMRRR to Medical Data Systems general (1692g subsection request for proof of their right to collect the debt.
5/15/2012 -- Pulled Report. EQ is now showing it as "Consumer disputes, reinvestigation in process" (what? There was no original investigation!)
5/29/2012 -- Pulled Report. EQ went back to previous data. None of the three show this debt as being in dispute.

I'm assuming that the CA "verified" the debt, and the next thing to do is to send the two letters here:
http://www.whychat.5...cavalhipaa.html
First demanding proof of ability to collect the debt from the CA (which if they provide will show the OC is violating HIPAA)
Second to the CRAs requesting the protected information they got from the CA.

I haven't quite sent the "right" letters but I will be able to document transmittal of PHR via this process. It might take an extra round of letters, but I don't think I torpedoed the situation.

I gave the OC 60 days to respond to the PFD. If I don't hear back from them within that time, then I'm going to start going after them harder. I'm hoping they take the PFD, which will result in me getting a letter from them (after payment) that the item should be deleted, which I can then send to the CRAs.

No specific question here, just starting the thread to document my process.

Two things I did not do:
Opt Out- Not sure why to do this, I guess that's the next thing I'll search. I've been watching the offers as the scores change. I know the CRAs are selling my information, but I'm looking for credit and these pre-approvals tell me where I am. Once I am done applying I'll probably opt out.
Delete Addresses- Actually deleted some obsolete addresses but this will have no effect on this current issue, since the OC has my current address and I haven't moved. I could change all my addresses and then try and delete this address (the one the CA is using) but that would be kinda silly given that I just wrote the three CRAs and told them to use this address to communicate with me.

[Why Chat]

I started this round of repair before I was aware of the HIPAA process, and I'm still having trouble following why chat's website, it gets kinda confusing.

Interestingly this company is reporting this as an "open" revolving account on TU.

Here's what's happened so far:
5/1/2012-- Wrote the OC CMRRR pointing out that they had violated our contract, had failed to provide the services being billed, that I revoked my HIPAA disclosure authorization, demanded they turn no more info over to any CA since there was no business purpose given that we were in negotiations to resolve, and finally offered a PFD based on partial payment. Sent this to the "HIPAA Compliance Officer"
5/1/2012-- Wrote CMRRR all three CRAs asking for verification of debt listed by "Medical Data Systems" (this company uses so many names, designed to confuse I'm sure.)
5/1/2012-- Wrote CMRRR to Medical Data Systems general (1692g subsection request for proof of their right to collect the debt.
5/15/2012 -- Pulled Report. EQ is now showing it as "Consumer disputes, reinvestigation in process" (what? There was no original investigation!)
5/29/2012 -- Pulled Report. EQ went back to previous data. None of the three show this debt as being in dispute.

I'm assuming that the CA "verified" the debt, and the next thing to do is to send the two letters here:
http://www.whychat.5...cavalhipaa.html
First demanding proof of ability to collect the debt from the CA (which if they provide will show the OC is violating HIPAA)
Second to the CRAs requesting the protected information they got from the CA.

I haven't quite sent the "right" letters but I will be able to document transmittal of PHR via this process. It might take an extra round of letters, but I don't think I torpedoed the situation.

I gave the OC 60 days to respond to the PFD. If I don't hear back from them within that time, then I'm going to start going after them harder. I'm hoping they take the PFD, which will result in me getting a letter from them (after payment) that the item should be deleted, which I can then send to the CRAs.

No specific question here, just starting the thread to document my process.

Two things I did not do:
Opt Out- Not sure why to do this, I guess that's the next thing I'll search. I've been watching the offers as the scores change. I know the CRAs are selling my information, but I'm looking for credit and these pre-approvals tell me where I am. Once I am done applying I'll probably opt out.
Delete Addresses- Actually deleted some obsolete addresses but this will have no effect on this current issue, since the OC has my current address and I haven't moved. I could change all my addresses and then try and delete this address (the one the CA is using) but that would be kinda silly given that I just wrote the three CRAs and told them to use this address to communicate with me.

What was the date of medical service??

Is this for more than $1,000??

Is it on all your reports??

I hardly know what to tell you as what you have done has NOTHING to do with the HIPAA letter program.

I will TRY to help you if you can provide the above data and what State you are in.

( Opting out will help you dispute the account, if you haven't moved since the date of service there is no reason to delete old addresses, the fact that the OC has your correct address is not the issue, the issue is if the reporting CA has it)

[LizaW]

What was the date of medical service??

Is this for more than $1,000??

Is it on all your reports??

I hardly know what to tell you as what you have done has NOTHING to do with the HIPAA letter program.

I will TRY to help you if you can provide the above data and what State you are in.

( Opting out will help you dispute the account, if you haven't moved since the date of service there is no reason to delete old addresses, the fact that the OC has your correct address is not the issue, the issue is if the reporting CA has it)

Service occurred in summer of 2010, so just shy of 2 years ago at this point. The amount being claimed is between $1,000 and $2,000. I do not have the exact correct amount. It is being reported on all three reports. The jurisdiction for all this would be Oklahoma, though the CA is in Florida.

I wrote these letters before hearing about the HIPAA program you have on your website, so I wasn't following that program. The OC is in violation of our contract in several ways, and I was pursuing a PFD method with them. At the same time, I wanted MDS to fail to verify the debt while continuing to collect. I just got a letter from EQ saying the item was "verified", so I have MDS on that violation of the FDCPA. My main point there was to start the clock on them so they start racking up violations.

Regarding opting out, I do know the reporting CA does have my correct address because they sent a dunning letter to it.

Regarding your program-- At this stage I'm waiting to see if MDS sends me proof of the debt that documents a current business relationship with the OC. The OC already has my revocation of authorization for info, though that may be legally irrelevant, they also have a firm offer to settle the debt, and a statement that I will not do business with any CA. I don't know if a firm offer of payment removes the business relationship justification for giving info to the CA.

I see three possibilities:
1. They accept my PFD and thus I have a letter from them that should get the account deleted.
2. They refuse my PFD, in which case we negotiate.
3. They outright refuse any possibility of PFD or dealing with me, and insist I have to deal with the CA.

As I understand it, the first step of your process is to PIF, and so I may not need it. However, I am quite interested in any letters I can send to the CA or the CRA that will get this item removed, if I'm unable to get the OC to agree to a PFD.

If three happens, I'll escalate with them to see if I can get them to see reason, in part because I don't think they are intentionally engaging in fraud, and eventually they must realize that some money is better than no money (And incurring the cost of my regularly arriving letters.) However, at that point I'd want to also pursue avenues that get this deleted without paying the OC. After all, at that point I've engaged in a good faith attempt to resolve the issue, an they are refusing and saying I have to deal with some third party with whom I have no contractual obligation.

Edited by LizaW, 01 June 2012 - 05:35 PM.

[Why Chat]

What was the date of medical service??

Is this for more than $1,000??

Is it on all your reports??

I hardly know what to tell you as what you have done has NOTHING to do with the HIPAA letter program.

I will TRY to help you if you can provide the above data and what State you are in.

( Opting out will help you dispute the account, if you haven't moved since the date of service there is no reason to delete old addresses, the fact that the OC has your correct address is not the issue, the issue is if the reporting CA has it)

Service occurred in summer of 2010, so just shy of 2 years ago at this point. The amount being billed is between $1,000 and $2,000. I do not have the exact correct amount. It is being reported on all three reports. The jurisdiction for all this would be Oklahoma, though the CA is in Florida.

I wrote these letters before hearing about the HIPAA program you have on your website, so I wasn't following that program. The OC is in violation of our contract in several ways, and I was pursuing a PFD method with them. At the same time, I wanted MDS to fail to verify the debt while continuing to collect. I just got a letter from EQ saying the item was "verified", so I have MDS on that violation of the FDCPA. My main point there was to start the clock on them so they start racking up violations.

Regarding opting out, I do know the reporting CA does have my correct address because they sent a dunning letter to it.

Regarding your program-- At this stage I'm waiting to see if MDS sends me proof of the debt that documents a current business relationship with the OC. The OC already has my revocation of authorization for info, though that may be legally irrelevant, they also have a firm offer to settle the debt, and a statement that I will not do business with any CA. I don't know if a firm offer of payment removes the business relationship justification for giving info to the CA.

I see three possibilities:
1. They accept my PFD and thus I have a letter from them that should get the account deleted.
2. They refuse my PFD, in which case we negotiate.
3. They outright refuse any possibility of PFD or dealing with me, and insist I have to deal with the CA.

As I understand it, the first step of your process is to PIF, and so I may not need it. However, I am quite interested in any letters I can send to the CA or the CRA that will get this item removed, if I'm unable to get the OC to agree to a PFD.

If three happens, I'll escalate with them to see if I can get them to see reason, in part because I don't think they are intentionally engaging in fraud, and eventually they must realize that some money is better than no money (And incurring the cost of my regularly arriving letters.) However, at that point I'd want to also pursue avenues that get this deleted without paying the OC.

You are living in a dream world. There is NOTHING about your approach that makes any sense.

The FIRST STEP in "my" approach is to OPT OUT. This prevents ANY changes made in your reports from being SOLD to data miners.

The SECOND STEP in "my" approach is to get old addresses deleted IF you have moved since the date of medical service.

The THIRD STEP in "my" approach is to send the initial dispute letter to the CRAs
http://www.whychat.5.../hipaadisp.html

This allows for the quick deletion of INVALID accounts, ie those accounts that are not the result of a PRIMARY assignment from the OC. ( Contrary to your belief, it is perfectly legel for a CA to report and try to collect on accounts they have acquired from another CA or from a data miner)

The ONLY time payment is made to the OC is IF a clear documented CURRENT relationship is PROVEN to exist between the OC and the reporting CA. Full payment is required in THOSE circumstances EXCEPT if a lower payment can be documented by getting data from the proper sources, ( linked in insert "a")
http://www.whychat.5u.com/hipltr.html

What you have done, and have proclaimed as "correct" and what you have refused to do out of some sort of stubborn blindness to the facts and ignorance of both the FDCPA, FCRA and HIPAA is to blindly fumble your way into a dead end situation.

If you have a dispute about proper billing, and you have evidence to back it up, you should contact the OC patient relations department and try to straighten it out. If you had insurance, you should contact your insurance Co. If you had no insurance and qualified for the medically needy program you should have applied.

If you had no insurance AND were not medically needy and it is a fairly large bill, you probably will be sued.

[LizaW]

You are living in a dream world. There is NOTHING about your approach that makes any sense.

The FIRST STEP in "my" approach is to OPT OUT. This prevents ANY changes made in your reports from being SOLD to data miners.

The SECOND STEP in "my" approach is to get old addresses deleted IF you have moved since the date of medical service.

The THIRD STEP in "my" approach is to send the initial dispute letter to the CRAs
http://www.whychat.5.../hipaadisp.html

This allows for the quick deletion of INVALID accounts, ie those accounts that are not the result of a PRIMARY assignment from the OC. ( Contrary to your belief, it is perfectly legel for a CA to report and try to collect on accounts they have acquired from another CA or from a data miner)

The ONLY time payment is made to the OC is IF a clear documented CURRENT relationship is PROVEN to exist between the OC and the reporting CA. Full payment is required in THOSE circumstances EXCEPT if a lower payment can be documented by getting data from the proper sources, ( linked in insert "a")
http://www.whychat.5u.com/hipltr.html

What you have done, and have proclaimed as "correct" and what you have refused to do out of some sort of stubborn blindness to the facts and ignorance of both the FDCPA, FCRA and HIPAA is to blindly fumble your way into a dead end situation.

If you have a dispute about proper billing, and you have evidence to back it up, you should contact the OC patient relations department and try to straighten it out. If you had insurance, you should contact your insurance Co. If you had no insurance and qualified for the medically needy program you should have applied.

If you had no insurance AND were not medically needy and it is a fairly large bill, you probably will be sued.

Your hostility is uncalled for. Further, you repeatedly put words in my mouth and then use them to attack me.

I sent the letters in question a month before I even registered for this board, and as I stated in the very first post, before I'd ever heard of your HIPAA process. I have stated this fact in every single post I made in this thread.

I find it amusing that you would characterize PFD and DV and negotiating with an OC as going "into a dead end situation". I did not, at any point, claim some approach was better than yours. I simply answered your questions. It is silly to accuse me of "some sort of stubborn blindness, to the facts and ignorance" simply because I didn't send letters you recommend before I'd ever heard of you. I was supposed to invent time travel?

Frankly, there's no reason for you to be offended. I was just stating what I've done, and answering your questions.

Edited by LizaW, 01 June 2012 - 06:47 PM.

[Why Chat]

You are living in a dream world. There is NOTHING about your approach that makes any sense.

The FIRST STEP in "my" approach is to OPT OUT. This prevents ANY changes made in your reports from being SOLD to data miners.

The SECOND STEP in "my" approach is to get old addresses deleted IF you have moved since the date of medical service.

The THIRD STEP in "my" approach is to send the initial dispute letter to the CRAs
http://www.whychat.5.../hipaadisp.html

This allows for the quick deletion of INVALID accounts, ie those accounts that are not the result of a PRIMARY assignment from the OC. ( Contrary to your belief, it is perfectly legel for a CA to report and try to collect on accounts they have acquired from another CA or from a data miner)

The ONLY time payment is made to the OC is IF a clear documented CURRENT relationship is PROVEN to exist between the OC and the reporting CA. Full payment is required in THOSE circumstances EXCEPT if a lower payment can be documented by getting data from the proper sources, ( linked in insert "a")
http://www.whychat.5u.com/hipltr.html

What you have done, and have proclaimed as "correct" and what you have refused to do out of some sort of stubborn blindness to the facts and ignorance of both the FDCPA, FCRA and HIPAA is to blindly fumble your way into a dead end situation.

If you have a dispute about proper billing, and you have evidence to back it up, you should contact the OC patient relations department and try to straighten it out. If you had insurance, you should contact your insurance Co. If you had no insurance and qualified for the medically needy program you should have applied.

If you had no insurance AND were not medically needy and it is a fairly large bill, you probably will be sued.

Your hostility is uncalled for. Further, you repeatedly put words in my mouth and then use them to attack me.

I sent the letters in question a month before I even registered for this board, and as I stated in the very first post, before I'd ever heard of your HIPAA process. I have stated this fact in every single post I made in this thread.

I find it amusing that you would characterize PFD and DV and negotiating with an OC as going "into a dead end situation". I did not, at any point, claim some approach was better than yours. I simply answered your questions. It is silly to accuse me of "some sort of stubborn blindness, to the facts and ignorance" simply because I didn't send letters you recommend before I'd ever heard of you. I was supposed to invent time travel?

Frankly, there's no reason for you to be offended. I was just stating what I've done, and answering your questions.

I was perfectly prepared to give you my full polite attention until I saw that you spread your "advice" to another poster in this forum.

Your "time travel" excuse doesn't work for THAT.

It is bad enough to make mistakes for your own situation out of ignorance, but to spread your misinformation to others who might be tempted to follow your bad advice is the reason for my taking offense.

The HIPAA letter program is a carefully designed program that has worked for almost all those who are willing and able to follow instructions. Taking bits and pieces out and using the language in some of the letters to advance your own ideas will not work.

[breeze]

Liza, I have been working with Why Chat for years. His advice is good, it works, and not only that, he is here day and night. This forum is built around the HIPAA method of getting medical debts deleted successfully.

[LizaW]

Liza, I have been working with Why Chat for years. His advice is good, it works, and not only that, he is here day and night. This forum is built around the HIPAA method of getting medical debts deleted successfully.

I never said otherwise. However, since you're an admin weighing in publicly, please show me exactly which statements of mine justified his personal attacks, disparagement and name calling.

Further, since you are not addressing these personal attacks, your post sounds like an endorsement of them. If this is a forum where this kind of activity is accepted, then I'm now aware of it.

If this kind of activity is not accepted, then the rules should apply to everyone equally, correct?

Or am I to read between the lines and gather that the inner circle can act with immunity but us peons must be obsequious at all times?

Edited by LizaW, 01 June 2012 - 08:39 PM.

[MarvBear]

Personally, I would pay very close attention to the advice offered by Why Chat. After years of reading and knowing and receiving help, I can positively state Why Chat's advice to be invaluable.

[LizaW]

Personally, I would pay very close attention to the advice offered by Why Chat. After years of reading and knowing and receiving help, I can positively state Why Chat's advice to be invaluable.

What I really want to know is how you feel about his name calling, and his disparaging comments?

[MarvBear]

Personally, I would pay very close attention to the advice offered by Why Chat. After years of reading and knowing and receiving help, I can positively state Why Chat's advice to be invaluable.

What I really want to know is how you feel about his name calling, and his disparaging comments?

What I want to know, is do you really want some help, or do you just want to start an forum argument? If it's the latter of the two, not interested.

[LizaW]

What I want to know, is do you really want some help, or do you just want to start an forum argument? If it's the latter of the two, not interested.

Don't you dare pretend like I'm being a troublemaker here. I responded politely even after Why started calling me names. When it became too much, rather than responding in kind I reported the post. Only to have moderators show up and refuse to respond to the issue at hand honestly. You can say anything you want, but you can't change the facts of reality-- unless you start going to censor past posts, they are all there in black and white, if you will read them. So, don't expect me to pretend like your accusation is acceptable. You have just impeached your integrity in full.

I just wanted to talk about my experiences here. Period. If you and why never enter this thread again, that's fine by me.

Since you're obviously not going to enforce the rules, will you leave me in peace?

Edited by LizaW, 01 June 2012 - 09:46 PM.

[scottg02]

What I want to know, is do you really want some help, or do you just want to start an forum argument? If it's the latter of the two, not interested.

Don't you dare pretend like I'm being a troublemaker here. I responded politely even after Why started calling me names.

I found the thread that set him off-- it was one where I offered some information to another poster and that poster thanked me. The next response (by timestamp) was Why having a conniption and then he came in here and started abusing me.

I just wanted to talk about my experiences here. Period. If you and why never enter this thread again, that's fine by me.

Since you're obviously not going to enforce the rules, will you leave me in peace?

Your the one trying to cause trouble instead of just letting things go. This is their forums and they are trying to help you, if you don't like it than noone is forcing you to stay here.

[LizaW]

Your the one trying to cause trouble instead of just letting things go. This is their forums and they are trying to help you, if you don't like it than noone is forcing you to stay here.

Here's me "causing trouble" that started all of it:
http://creditboards....5

I helped someone, they thanked me, and that was too much. Everything that happened is a result of that "crime" on my part.

Seriously, show me a single incidence of me causing trouble. All I did was describe my experience, answer questions and defend myself when attacked.

Edited by LizaW, 01 June 2012 - 09:54 PM.

[Why Chat]

You are NOT helping, you are HURTING other people.
Your posts are full of misinformation and bad advice. A new poster reading your "advice" has no way of knowing that it is INVALID so any thanks you got were unearned.

If you really want to help yourself and others, then go to the legal explanation of the HIPAA program on my website.

http://whychat.5u.com/hipaaleg.html

Even telling someone to "Google" a billing address is BAD ADVICE as the HIPAA letter program requires BYPASSING the billing department which, as you said, is frequently at another location.

[MarvBear]

What I want to know, is do you really want some help, or do you just want to start an forum argument? If it's the latter of the two, not interested.

Don't you dare pretend like I'm being a troublemaker here. I responded politely even after Why started calling me names. When it became too much, rather than responding in kind I reported the post. Only to have moderators show up and refuse to respond to the issue at hand honestly. You can say anything you want, but you can't change the facts of reality-- unless you start going to censor past posts, they are all there in black and white, if you will read them. So, don't expect me to pretend like your accusation is acceptable. You have just impeached your integrity in full.

I just wanted to talk about my experiences here. Period. If you and why never enter this thread again, that's fine by me.

Since you're obviously not going to enforce the rules, will you leave me in peace?

I asked you a question, nothing more, nothing less. Period. Which you neglected to answer.

Then again, your statement regarding impeachment, upon reflection, amply answered that asked question.

[LKH]

What I want to know, is do you really want some help, or do you just want to start an forum argument? If it's the latter of the two, not interested.

Don't you dare pretend like I'm being a troublemaker here. I responded politely even after Why started calling me names. When it became too much, rather than responding in kind I reported the post. Only to have moderators show up and refuse to respond to the issue at hand honestly. You can say anything you want, but you can't change the facts of reality-- unless you start going to censor past posts, they are all there in black and white, if you will read them. So, don't expect me to pretend like your accusation is acceptable. You have just impeached your integrity in full.

I just wanted to talk about my experiences here. Period. If you and why never enter this thread again, that's fine by me.

Since you're obviously not going to enforce the rules, will you leave me in peace?

Do NOT even think you are going dictate a damn thing here. Either comply and learn as breeze has tried multiple times to get through to you, or get lost.