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Mom & Dad's Income Really Is The Best Predictor Of Junior's SAT Score


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63 replies to this topic

#1 hegemony

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 12:53 PM

http://www.businessi...at-score-2012-2



#2 Gronnie

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 01:06 PM

From the comments: "Why would this be a surprise to anybody?

Intelligence is hugely important in driving income, and intelligence is inheritable. Therefore, high income people, who are likely to be highly intelligent, have intelligent offspring.

No game rigging necessary."

Sums up my thoughts almost exactly.

#3 blackberry74

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 01:11 PM

Uh...no.

#4 selfmadetool

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 01:13 PM

Yes, it's definitely a level playing field when high income families have the ability to send their children to better schools, sometimes where the student to teacher ratio can be as low as 3 to 1, or when parents drop 5 figures annually on private tutoring.

Edited by selfmadetool, 22 February 2012 - 01:15 PM.


#5 Tigz

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 01:27 PM

On one side it makes sense. And comments above agree with that "model"

However, it does not take into account the variables that distinguish the groups.

"Intellect" may have little to do with it. Motivation and availability of tutoring services probably have a more to do with it than their "IQ".

The graph shows a trend, but it has little to do with explaining "why".

#6 Boofie400

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 01:29 PM

I have access to high income people and I can tell you that very few of them would be considered highly intelligent. What they are intensely good at is selling themselves.

#7 blackberry74

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 01:32 PM

More income simply means greater access to opportunities and likely a much better school system and/or private school, not to mention tutors, extracurriculars, etc. It has nothing whatsoever to do with intelligence. If you take the other tack, then you're saying that poor people aren't intelligent or can't be intelligent, which is just...stupid.

#8 Tigz

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 01:35 PM

I have access to high income people and I can tell you that very few of them would be considered highly intelligent. What they are intensely good at is selling themselves.


I also know some high income people...doctors and lawyers to be specific....and they are extremely intelligent. Although I do have to admit that at least one of them scores a zero when it comes to common sense.

#9 ERIC0728

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 01:46 PM

The standard deviation is of 20%. My take is that if one would plot the distribution of the actual data, you'd see tremendous amounts of these data overlap, and the comparisons between most pairwise income categories will not be statistically significant.

#10 cashnocredit

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 01:47 PM

There has been a very long term trend towards the use of tools as productivity levers. Individual ability to use the various tools varies enormously. These tools change rapidly and this favors highly adaptive workers and those that are new and haven't yet developed the inertia of a complex, but declining in value, skill set.

Not that long ago a facility in statistics and math meant you could get a pretty decent job as an actuary (rec'ed by my hs guidance counselor) or academic. Good jobs but not out of this world pay. These days the sky's the limit doing quant work for the Goldman Sax's and hedge funds. High freq trading and real time correlation with all sorts of data sources has been the source pf seriously large incomes for math PhDs.

What this has done to society and will do in the future is very much a topic of debate, concern. The Singularity perhaps. The day may not be far off when we are put in zoos by our creations.

#11 cljohnr

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 01:52 PM

I suspect higher household income happens to correlate to other, more relevant, factors. Things like two parent households and parents with college educations. I'd wager the kids of two high school teachers, who might have an $80k household inccome, score as highly as the children of professional athletes.

#12 cashnocredit

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 02:05 PM

I suspect higher household income happens to correlate to other, more relevant, factors. Things like two parent households and parents with college educations. I'd wager the kids of two high school teachers, who might have an $80k household inccome, score as highly as the children of professional athletes.


Quite possible, OTOH children of professional athletes are more likely than others to become professional athletes. Children of violinists are more likely to make money playing instruments. Children of preachers are more likely to go into the ministry. It depends to a great degree on what parents value.

#13 Gronnie

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 02:57 PM

More income simply means greater access to opportunities and likely a much better school system and/or private school, not to mention tutors, extracurriculars, etc. It has nothing whatsoever to do with intelligence. If you take the other tack, then you're saying that poor people aren't intelligent or can't be intelligent, which is just...stupid.


Before even reading the replies I knew someone would make this straw man argument. Nobody said that poor people can't be intelligent. I would be willing to bet a significant amount that on average wealthy people are more intelligent than poor people though.

This is coming from someone who is squarely in the middle class. I am by no means wealthy.

Edited by Gronnie, 22 February 2012 - 03:03 PM.


#14 blackberry74

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 03:03 PM

Uh huh. I'm not even sure why you even bothered to respond to something you claimed never to have said in the first place.

Edited by blackberry74, 22 February 2012 - 03:04 PM.


#15 Gronnie

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 03:12 PM

Uh huh. I'm not even sure why you even bothered to respond to something you claimed never to have said in the first place.


You aren't going to get very far arguing based off emotions and taking things personally.

#16 blackberry74

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 03:23 PM

I have no idea what you're talking about - so now we have something in common, because you don't either. Perhaps you should re-read your last post to yourself and then heed it. Good day.

Now back to the relevant conversation, which is the apparent correlation of money and intelligence.

Edited by blackberry74, 22 February 2012 - 03:24 PM.


#17 giraffy

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 03:27 PM

Excellent. :rofl:

Who is the new person acting new?!

#18 Tigz

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 05:10 PM

There IS a correlation between highly intelligent people (ie, eggheads) having children who are also highly intelligent (especially if both parents were eggheady).

How - the - ever......

I don't think those people are the people who these statistics are referring to. And really, these statistics are useless unless they come up with a reason for the disparity. Therefore, I think BB is right....more income means that these kids probably have more access to educational tools such as tutors, private schools, etc......not that people who make more money are smarter.

#19 Nemeweh

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 06:44 PM

:blink:



I like it when new people get mouthy with BB74, not realizing she once pushed a man off a bridge just because he was holding up traffic.





:grin:

#20 blackberry74

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 06:49 PM

Tigz, that's pretty much all I was saying.

It's rude to tell my business, Nem. You & Giraffable are some troublemakers. :beee:

#21 Bad Doctor Frost

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 07:16 PM

This should surprise no one. Typically smarter people wait to have children until they're financially ready and at a point in their life where they can raise kids. It should be no surprise that they have more financially than Doug and Debbie Dropout who ended up getting knocked up behind a KFC. And, generally, poverty breeds poverty. Lazy parents begat lazy kids. And the poor reproduce faster than the well-off. It's disgusting and frustrating.

#22 cashnocredit

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 07:43 PM

This should surprise no one. Typically smarter people wait to have children until they're financially ready and at a point in their life where they can raise kids. It should be no surprise that they have more financially than Doug and Debbie Dropout who ended up getting knocked up behind a KFC. And, generally, poverty breeds poverty. Lazy parents begat lazy kids. And the poor reproduce faster than the well-off. It's disgusting and frustrating.


Hey. Begatting is fun! And cheap. Initially that is.

#23 LogicalNoMore

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 08:39 PM


This should surprise no one. Typically smarter people wait to have children until they're financially ready and at a point in their life where they can raise kids. It should be no surprise that they have more financially than Doug and Debbie Dropout who ended up getting knocked up behind a KFC. And, generally, poverty breeds poverty. Lazy parents begat lazy kids. And the poor reproduce faster than the well-off. It's disgusting and frustrating.


Hey. Begatting is fun! And cheap. Initially that is.


Woah.... untrue and narrow in thinking comments....
...You did inspire this poverty ridden Divorced lady to go hug her, two time masters, gifted, summa cum laude son who makes
good to break this cycle .

Would you like your humble pie with or without Whipped cream?

#24 Tigz

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 08:53 PM

He didn't say it happened to everyone.

However distasteful it sounded, he did state a truism....not an always-ism. (I am referring to poverty breeding poverty)

What he said might not be politically correct, and some might call it a "stereotype".....but it is one "stereotype" that has overwhelming stats to back it up.
Back in the day when there was actual money for education and social services, they could have taken that data and tried to figure out a way to make it an even playing field for all children, so that all of them had a brighter future to look forward to.

Right now, until we get out of "the current economic conditions that the country/world is in", very few have a brighter future to look forward to (at least educationally).

So I doubt BDF will be eating any "humble pie".

#25 Bad Doctor Frost

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 08:54 PM



This should surprise no one. Typically smarter people wait to have children until they're financially ready and at a point in their life where they can raise kids. It should be no surprise that they have more financially than Doug and Debbie Dropout who ended up getting knocked up behind a KFC. And, generally, poverty breeds poverty. Lazy parents begat lazy kids. And the poor reproduce faster than the well-off. It's disgusting and frustrating.


Hey. Begatting is fun! And cheap. Initially that is.


Woah.... untrue and narrow in thinking comments....
...You did inspire this poverty ridden Divorced lady to go hug her, two time masters, gifted, summa cum laude son who makes
good to break this cycle .

Would you like your humble pie with or without Whipped cream?


Exception, not the norm.




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