100 replies to this topic

[Jen23514]

The point of this post is to consolidate the 623 discussions and provide a resource.

First of all, I am on the verge of suing using 623 DF attacks based on my previous threads. But as of this posting, I have not, so I want you to understand that while I have had some OC (and CA) TLs removed using this process, it has not (yet) escalated to courts. Hopefully someone will come along and add their court POV using 623. I have downloaded some cases based on it, but would love to hear first hand reports.

Secondly, here are the related threads I think is handy for you to reference.

link to 623 : http://www4.law.corn...81---s002-.html

disputing with OCs : http://creditboards....s...asc&start=0 (esp post 9 by Sassy)

more discussion on 623 (starts p4) : http://creditboards....s...3721&st=120

dixie's thoughts on OCs : http://creditboards....?showtopic=3236

for disputed TL's that are reporting differently between the bureaus: http://creditboards....?showtopic=4128

more on disputing with furnishers (thanks again Sassy) : http://creditboards....?showtopic=4138

if you want to take the discussion deeper, is the court a DF? : http://creditboards....s...c=55986&hl=

jen (mine) thoughts on using 623 in combination with the 1-2 punch : http://creditboards....s...=341108&hl=

LKH / Sassy discussion on 623 : http://creditboards....showtopic=18703

FTC responsibilities of furnishers : http://www.ftc.gov/o...es/2furnshr.htm

by knight : http://creditboards....howtopic=343983

know thy state laws : http://creditboards....s...c=34830&hl=

abbreviated versions of 623 letters I've used : http://creditboards....howtopic=379223


there are probably more, but those are my bookmarked ones on this laptop.

Common questions are :
Is 623 actionable by consumers?
How do I invoke a 623 dispute?
How is a 623 dispute different from a "normal" DV (FDCPA)?

What other questions are there on 623?

Edited by Jen23514, 04 February 2009 - 12:54 AM.

[jack1212]

Jen!!

I cant thank you enough for making this thread.

This WILL be a major breakthrough for consumers.

I have pondered some of these things for a long time.

I'll add discussion/questions tommorrow, when im not so sleepy, haha.


jack

[Jen23514]

I'll add discussion/questions tommorrow, when im not so sleepy, haha.

I look forward to it.

[clambert1273]

You know I will need this

[Jen23514]

http://www4.law.corn...81---s002-.html

(a) Duty of furnishers of information to provide accurate information
(1) Prohibition
(A) Reporting information with actual knowledge of errors
A person shall not furnish any information relating to a consumer to any consumer reporting agency if the person knows or has reasonable cause to believe that the information is inaccurate.

(B) Reporting information after notice and confirmation of errors
A person shall not furnish information relating to a consumer to any consumer reporting agency if—
(i) the person has been notified by the consumer, at the address specified by the person for such notices, that specific information is inaccurate; and
(ii) the information is, in fact, inaccurate.

© No address requirement
A person who clearly and conspicuously specifies to the consumer an address for notices referred to in subparagraph (B) shall not be subject to subparagraph (A); however, nothing in subparagraph (B) shall require a person to specify such an address.

(D) Definition
For purposes of subparagraph (A), the term “reasonable cause to believe that the information is inaccurate” means having specific knowledge, other than solely allegations by the consumer, that would cause a reasonable person to have substantial doubts about the accuracy of the information.

A consumer cannot sue to enforce section 623(a) -- enforcement is specific to the named governmental bodies

[Jen23514]

However, a consumer can sue to enforce section 623(B) which has a relationship with the (a) provisions.

(B) Duties of furnishers of information upon notice of dispute
(1) In general
After receiving notice pursuant to section 1681i (a)(2) of this title of a dispute with regard to the completeness or accuracy of any information provided by a person to a consumer reporting agency, the person shall�€”
(A) conduct an investigation with respect to the disputed information;
(B) review all relevant information provided by the consumer reporting agency pursuant to section 1681i (a)(2) of this title;
� report the results of the investigation to the consumer reporting agency;
(D) if the investigation finds that the information is incomplete or inaccurate, report those results to all other consumer reporting agencies to which the person furnished the information and that compile and maintain files on consumers on a nationwide basis; and
(E) if an item of information disputed by a consumer is found to be inaccurate or incomplete or cannot be verified after any reinvestigation under paragraph (1), for purposes of reporting to a consumer reporting agency only, as appropriate, based on the results of the reinvestigation promptly�€”
(i) modify that item of information;
(ii) delete that item of information; or
(iii) permanently block the reporting of that item of information.

http://www4.law.corn...81---s002-.html



My understanding of all of this is that you can sue the data furnsiher under section 623(B) of the FCRA for reporting inaccurate/unverifiable information. You have to dispute it with the credit bureau first and the provider verified it and continues to report info that you feel is inaccurate or unverifiable.

You then send the provider of info (OC, CA, etc) a dispute letter, requesting to know why they are reporting what they are reporting, and that you dispute it as inaccurate, unverifiable, etc, whatever you feel is inaccurate. The FCRA requires this dispute to be SPECIFIC.

Edited by Pam, 04 February 2009 - 10:56 AM.

[Jen23514]

FCRA Opinion letters : http://www.ftc.gov/os/statutes/fcra/

lots on 623 (a) there, but only 2 on 623 (B):

Tabler : http://www.ftc.gov/o...cra/tabler.shtm

Cohan : http://www.ftc.gov/o...cra/cohan2.shtm

[Jen23514]

You must dispute with the CRA first:

§ 623.© LIMITATION ON LIABILITY- Except as provided in section 621�(1)(B), sections 616 and 617 do not apply to any violation of--

(1) subsection (a) of this section, including any regulations issued thereunder;

(2) subsection (e) of this section, except that nothing in this paragraph shall limit, expand, or otherwise affect liability under section 616 or 617, as applicable, for violations of subsection (B) of this section;

Sections 616 and 617 of the FCRA talk about how much the fines are for violations of the FCRA the willful and negligent non compliance.

What the above section of the FCRA 623© means is that if you dispute with the original creditors first, without having disputing through the credit bureaus, and they refuse to answer you, or provide you with proof, yes, they are in violation of the FCRA, but you as a private citizen cannot take them to court and sue them; only your state authorities (like your state attorney general) or federal authorities (like the FTC) can sue them.

However, if you have disputed the information with the credit bureaus first, they are supposed to have talked to the original creditor, (even though we know that doesn't happen) and the original creditor is supposed to have at that time conducted an investigation, under FCRA 623(B), under which you can sue them.


it's late... and I think I just confused myself... I'll ponder more on this tomorrow :lol:

Edited by Pam, 04 February 2009 - 10:58 AM.

[Lynn37]

Thanks Jen,

You are right, Everything I have read says that as long as you dispute with the CRA's first, you can sue if nothing comes back from the DF. I am looking at the case law, because I am having do deal with this issue with midland.

I do have a good story about a 623. PR was doing their reporting, a payment I never made, Factoring company account, the works. I had been fighting them for months! As soon as I asked for a 623, they went poof! I had wish I had done that from the start.

[pryan67]

bumping another awesome thread by Jen...

[jack1212]

Dont Die....

[peanutandbutterbean]

oh wow this is awesome! Thanks Jen!

[Jen23514]

oh wow this is awesome! Thanks Jen!

thanks! I forgot I wrote this up one night. Maybe i need more insomnia! (jk)


Last week, Jack sent me these I hope they help someone else:

NOTICE TO FURNISHERS OF INFORMATION: OBLIGATIONS OF FURNISHERS UNDER THE FCRA
http://www.ftc.gov/o...09fcraappxg.pdf

http://www.ftc.gov/o...19factaappg.pdf

[Lynn37]

Should send this to midland. That is a group of ppl who does not have a clue.

Gosh I do not feel like suing.....

Thank Jen.

[Jen23514]

You can try. There is a link in my siggy how to do a 1-2 punch using a 623 dispute. start there.

[clambert1273]

alright... read every freakin link on there lol I understand the purpose and the way to pursue it... what I don't get tho is the grit of the 623 (maybe I was just too tired lol)...

I mean I understand the point being accountable as a data furnisher but what is the teeth for me

[jack1212]

Clambert,

A DF can be anyone. OC/CA, or Batman if he reports. FCRA 623 allows consumers to dispute directly with the DF.

Furthermore, the DF must respond in the same timeframe as the CRA, 30 days. (Thats the teeth).

The downside is that they CAN deem it Friv or irrelavent.


jack

[clambert1273]

OK... that is where I was confused... so it IS in the same time frame?? god talk about information overload LOL

PS Jack - left you a message on my thread as well...

[Jen23514]

as jack said, a DF is anyone who reports to your report.

as a DF, they have an obligation to report correctly.

if they do not, then you have the right to dispute with them directly as a data furnisher.

if you do a direct dispute, then they are required to respond within 30 days.

the dispute must be specific in nature.

[clambert1273]

and if they don't respond in the 30 days? You know who I will attack with this right lol

[Jen23514]

and if they don't respond in the 30 days? You know who I will attack with this right lol

*sigh*

the same thing that happens when the CRAs don't respond.... you have to fight it.

I wish I had a better answer than that.

[clambert1273]

well I figured the fight thing.. just didn't know if there was something else Of course, this will be used in my last battles .. only a few more CA's to go...

[Jen23514]

well I figured the fight thing.. just didn't know if there was something else Of course, this will be used in my last battles .. only a few more CA's to go...

but your last ones are toughies.

[jehu]

bump

[Melanie2009]

Great resources, Jen! Thx!