Unarmed boy shot and killed by neighborhood watch captain...

NeverQuietHere · May 17, 2012

Fallon, no worries. just had to tease ya.

Again there are a lot if ifs, and those circumstances belong to a lot of different individuals. However, following him on property where he had a right to be is not criminal. If Martin hit him first and was beating him on the ground I don't give a damn about what non-criminal matters led to up to it, it would make it Martin's own fault he was shot. If that's not what happened I would believe differently. I am open-minded enough to realize we don't know though.

Well, that's just stupid.

You wouldn't think so if you were being assaulted.

No, it IS stupid, being assaulted or not. TM knew some creep was following him and I don't see how anyone could NOT feel threatened by that. Plus, he was smaller than GZ. First Creep was following him in the truck and then on foot. I would be defensive, too. Even if TM threw the first punch, I think he was justified.

Following someone in general is not illegal, assuming you have a legal right to be in that place. To assume that person is a threat, is just that, an assumption, until a real threat is presented. To strike that person first is not defense.... that would be offense, which is assault. I think there are potential arguments justifying TM defending himself, assuming he was not the aggressor. If he was the aggressor though and presented a threat to GZ's life, he made a bad and immature decision to beat on the wrong guy and paid for it with his life.

Also, please make sure you are paying attention to the facts and not the stories. TM was not the cute kid in the photographs.. more like 6' tall 150+ lbs athletic. GZ is also not the tub-o-lard from his booking photo from years ago. He had lost some of that weight and is around 5'10". Not that I think size changes the justification, but since you do, don't be mislead.

So then based your own words, you agree that GZ was wrong to assume that TM was a threat while he was walking along minding his own business, looking around?

I teach MY kids that if someone is in a vehicle and is creeping up along beside them or behind them or pulls in front of them that they are to be very cautious and/or they are to run. WTH is the difference here? Obviously TM FELT threatened or unsafe since he mentioned being followed to his gf on the phone. So am I wrong in telling my kids that they are NOT to feel threatened by a creeper or someone watching them for more than a minute or two?

You don't know wth I have read or haven't read as far as this situation goes. I NEVER said he was "the cute kid in the photographs". But he wasn't some horrible looking kid either, nor did he look as threatening as you want us to feel that he is. 150 lbs is a lot different than 200lbs or 230lbs. I am NOT mislead on anything when it comes to this, who is making the ASSumptions now?

TM had just as much right to walking on that sidewalk and in that neighborhood as GZ.

Edited May 17, 2012 by NeverQuietHere

NeverQuietHere · May 17, 2012

At Common Law, an intentional act by one person that creates an apprehension in another of an imminent harmful or offensive contact.

An assault is carried out by a threat of bodily harm coupled with an apparent, present ability to cause the harm. It is both a crime and a tort and, therefore, may result in either criminal or civil liability. Generally, the common law definition is the same in criminal and Tort Law. There is, however, an additional Criminal Law category of assault consisting of an attempted but unsuccessful Battery.

Statutory definitions of assault in the various jurisdictions throughout the United States are not substantially different from the common-law definition.

Assault (565.050, 565.060, 565.070)

First degree assault is defined as attempting to kill or knowingly causing or attempting to cause physical injury to another person. First degree assault is a class B felony unless in the course thereof the actor inflicts serious physical injury on the victim in which case it is a class A felony.

Second degree assault is defined as (1) attempting to kill or knowingly causing or attempting to cause serious physical injury to another person under the influence of sudden passion arising out of adequate cause; or (2) attempting to cause or knowingly causing physical injury to another person by means of a deadly weapon or dangerous instrument; or (3) recklessly causing serious physical injury to another person; or (4) while in an intoxicated condition or under the influence of controlled substances or drugs, operating a motor vehicle in this state and, when so operating, acting with criminal negligence to cause physical injury to any other person than himself; or (5) reclessly causing physical injury to another person by means of discharge of a firearm. Second degree assault is a class C felony.

Third degree assault is defined as (1) attempting to cause or recklessly cause physical injury to another person; or (2) whith criminal negligence causing physical injury to another person by means of a deadly weapon; or (3) purposely placing another person in apprehension of immediate physical injury; or (4) recklessly engaging in conduct which creates a grave risk of death or serious physical injury to another person; or (5) knowingly causing physical contact with another person knowing the other person will regard the contact as offensive or provocative; or (6) knowingly causing physical contact with an incapacitated person, which a reasonable person who is not incapacitated would consider offensive or provocative. Third degree assault is a class A misdemeanor, except violations of subdivision (3) or (5) are class C misdemeanors. A person who has pled guilty to or been found guilty of the crime of assault in the third degree more than two times against any family or household member is guilty of a class D felony for the third or any subsequent commission of the crime of assault in the third degree when a class A misdemeanor.

Battery

In common law, criminal assault often accompanied battery. See common assault. The elements of battery are (1) a volitional act^[3] (2) done for the purpose of causing a harmful or offensive contact with another person or under circumstances that make such contact substantially certain to occur and (3) which causes such contact.^[4] Thus throwing a rock at someone for the purpose of hitting him is a battery if the rock in fact strikes the person and is an assault if the rock misses. The fact that the person may have been unaware that the rock had been thrown at him is irrelevant under this definition of assault.

cljohnr · May 17, 2012

You don't know wth I have read or haven't read as far as this situation goes. I NEVER said he was "the cute kid in the photographs". But he wasn't some horrible looking kid either, nor did he look as threatening as you want us to feel that he is. 150 lbs is a lot different than 200lbs or 230lbs. I am NOT mislead on anything when it comes to this, who is making the ASSumptions now?

Zimmerman is 5'8", 185 pounds.

http://cfnews13.com/content/dam/news/static/cfnews13/documents/george-zimmerman-booking-report-0412.pdf

NeverQuietHere · May 17, 2012

You don't know wth I have read or haven't read as far as this situation goes. I NEVER said he was "the cute kid in the photographs". But he wasn't some horrible looking kid either, nor did he look as threatening as you want us to feel that he is. 150 lbs is a lot different than 200lbs or 230lbs. I am NOT mislead on anything when it comes to this, who is making the ASSumptions now?

Zimmerman is 5'8", 185 pounds.

http://cfnews13.com/...report-0412.pdf

Yeah, the shooting was in Feb right? So... 6 weeks later he was arrested? Is it feasible then that he had dropped a few lbs?In all honesty, TM was the one who felt threatened. GZ did not. He was the one who got out of his car and started running after TM. Did he mention feeling like there was a physical threat to him on the 911 phone call? Even when he said that TM was walking towards him, I don't think he said he felt scared or alarmed that he would be hurt.

Edited May 17, 2012 by NeverQuietHere

cljohnr · May 17, 2012

You don't know wth I have read or haven't read as far as this situation goes. I NEVER said he was "the cute kid in the photographs". But he wasn't some horrible looking kid either, nor did he look as threatening as you want us to feel that he is. 150 lbs is a lot different than 200lbs or 230lbs. I am NOT mislead on anything when it comes to this, who is making the ASSumptions now?

Zimmerman is 5'8", 185 pounds.

http://cfnews13.com/...report-0412.pdf

Yeah, the shooting was in Feb right? So... 6 weeks later he was arrested? Is it feasible then that he had dropped a few lbs?

It is common for people who are worried or stressed to eat comfort food. It's feasible that he did that for six weeks and put on 25 pounds. I haven't read or seen anything that would lead me to believe he did so, just like I haven't read or seen anything which would indicate that he somehow managed to lose 45 pounds in 6 weeks. What was that about assumptions?

NeverQuietHere · May 17, 2012

You don't know wth I have read or haven't read as far as this situation goes. I NEVER said he was "the cute kid in the photographs". But he wasn't some horrible looking kid either, nor did he look as threatening as you want us to feel that he is. 150 lbs is a lot different than 200lbs or 230lbs. I am NOT mislead on anything when it comes to this, who is making the ASSumptions now?

Zimmerman is 5'8", 185 pounds.

http://cfnews13.com/...report-0412.pdf

Yeah, the shooting was in Feb right? So... 6 weeks later he was arrested? Is it feasible then that he had dropped a few lbs?

It is common for people who are worried or stressed to eat comfort food. It's feasible that he did that for six weeks and put on 25 pounds. I haven't read or seen anything that would lead me to believe he did so, just like I haven't read or seen anything which would indicate that he somehow managed to lose 45 pounds in 6 weeks. What was that about assumptions?

It is also common for people NOT to eat when they are stressed. I won't take back what I said about someone putting words in my mouth or making assumptions. 200lbs is still a big difference from 150lbs. Ask any woman.

Snork Maiden · May 17, 2012

Again there are a lot if ifs, and those circumstances belong to a lot of different individuals. However, following him on property where he had a right to be is not criminal. If Martin hit him first and was beating him on the ground I don't give a damn about what non-criminal matters led to up to it, it would make it Martin's own fault he was shot. If that's not what happened I would believe differently. I am open-minded enough to realize we don't know though.

Well, that's just stupid.

You wouldn't think so if you were being assaulted.

I don't actively pursue fleeing strangers in the dark, but if I did, and got assaulted, I'd have it coming. Because that's dumb.

Tell me how this law would differentiate between the two cases. Let's take out the alcohol and say it was at a football game. two guys get into a fight. One guy shoots (or stabs) the other because he "feared for his life" (because the other guy was serving him up a proper azz beating.)

Guy who shoots is the one who threw the first punch?

*And Blackberry, you're right, if he'd stayed in his car, this wouldn't have happened. But by the sounds of the tape, he was already out of his car and following him before being told to stop. (Perfectly legal, and does not meet the definition of "stalking" and there's a good chance lots of people would do the same thing, especially on a neighborhood watch). If, as GZ has said, he stopped and TM doubled back around and confronted him, did GZ not have a right to defend himself at that point?

That's the point - he should have never gotten out of his car in the first place. It was unforgivably stupid. The "lots of people" who purportedly would do the same thing are equally stupid. As for TM confronting him...if I believed anything out of Zimmerman's mouth, which I don't...some creeper following me in his car and then on foot would cause me all kinds of apprehension. I wouldn't be inclined to hold a conversation with some fool who did that to me. I'd be more inclined to crack him in the dome with whatever I could find. And if anybody is seriously trying to sell me the story that Zimmerman believed his life was in danger from some kid that he outweighed by 50 or more pounds - please. You shouldn't run around inviting confrontations if you can't handle them once they start.

Following someone in general is not illegal, assuming you have a legal right to be in that place. To assume that person is a threat, is just that, an assumption, until a real threat is presented. To strike that person first is not defense.... that would be offense, which is assault. I think there are potential arguments justifying TM defending himself, assuming he was not the aggressor. If he was the aggressor though and presented a threat to GZ's life, he made a bad and immature decision to beat on the wrong guy and paid for it with his life.

An act doesn't have to be illegal to be aggressive. I'm with Blackberry, if some dude gets out of the car, and follows me around in a 'high crime' neighborhood, I would feel threatened and intimidated. I am certainly not waiting around until he shoves me into a dark alley so "the real threat presents itself".

I am not sure if following is considered an assault, but I'm pretty sure that Nutty Patroller failed to meet the standard of what a "reasonable" person would do under the circumstances. Especially, since as part of the Neighborhood Watch, he was instructed very clearly to observe and report, not follow or get involved.

road2freedom · May 17, 2012

Fallon, no worries. just had to tease ya.

Again there are a lot if ifs, and those circumstances belong to a lot of different individuals. However, following him on property where he had a right to be is not criminal. If Martin hit him first and was beating him on the ground I don't give a damn about what non-criminal matters led to up to it, it would make it Martin's own fault he was shot. If that's not what happened I would believe differently. I am open-minded enough to realize we don't know though.

Well, that's just stupid.

You wouldn't think so if you were being assaulted.

No, it IS stupid, being assaulted or not. TM knew some creep was following him and I don't see how anyone could NOT feel threatened by that. Plus, he was smaller than GZ. First Creep was following him in the truck and then on foot. I would be defensive, too. Even if TM threw the first punch, I think he was justified.

Following someone in general is not illegal, assuming you have a legal right to be in that place. To assume that person is a threat, is just that, an assumption, until a real threat is presented. To strike that person first is not defense.... that would be offense, which is assault. I think there are potential arguments justifying TM defending himself, assuming he was not the aggressor. If he was the aggressor though and presented a threat to GZ's life, he made a bad and immature decision to beat on the wrong guy and paid for it with his life.

Also, please make sure you are paying attention to the facts and not the stories. TM was not the cute kid in the photographs.. more like 6' tall 150+ lbs athletic. GZ is also not the tub-o-lard from his booking photo from years ago. He had lost some of that weight and is around 5'10". Not that I think size changes the justification, but since you do, don't be mislead.

So then based your own words, you agree that GZ was wrong to assume that TM was a threat while he was walking along minding his own business, looking around?

I teach MY kids that if someone is in a vehicle and is creeping up along beside them or behind them or pulls in front of them that they are to be very cautious and/or they are to run. WTH is the difference here? Obviously TM FELT threatened or unsafe since he mentioned being followed to his gf on the phone. So am I wrong in telling my kids that they are NOT to feel threatened by a creeper or someone watching them for more than a minute or two?

You don't know wth I have read or haven't read as far as this situation goes. I NEVER said he was "the cute kid in the photographs". But he wasn't some horrible looking kid either, nor did he look as threatening as you want us to feel that he is. 150 lbs is a lot different than 200lbs or 230lbs. I am NOT mislead on anything when it comes to this, who is making the ASSumptions now?

TM had just as much right to walking on that sidewalk and in that neighborhood as GZ.

You are proving my point. You teach your kids to run or seek safety. Not to attack. Most people teach their kids that you get away if you can and you fight back if you have to. I'm saying if TM attacked first, then the consequence was his own doing. If GZ started the physical altercation or done something illegale and had been shot (assuming the other person had a right to be there and was legally carrying a concealed weapon) I'd probably agree that was just as well.

I don't dispute TM's right to be there, and never have.

And as proven above... you are still mislead about the size comparison of the two individuals. "Horrible looking" is subjective... but in the most recent photos he posted online he doesn't appear as innocent as the original photos suggest.

blackberry74 · May 17, 2012

WTF does some kid flipping the bird in some pictures have to do with him being shot down like a dog by some fool who had no knowledge of those pictures, his school records, or anything else?

NeverQuietHere · May 17, 2012

Fallon, no worries. just had to tease ya.

Again there are a lot if ifs, and those circumstances belong to a lot of different individuals. However, following him on property where he had a right to be is not criminal. If Martin hit him first and was beating him on the ground I don't give a damn about what non-criminal matters led to up to it, it would make it Martin's own fault he was shot. If that's not what happened I would believe differently. I am open-minded enough to realize we don't know though.

Well, that's just stupid.

You wouldn't think so if you were being assaulted.

No, it IS stupid, being assaulted or not. TM knew some creep was following him and I don't see how anyone could NOT feel threatened by that. Plus, he was smaller than GZ. First Creep was following him in the truck and then on foot. I would be defensive, too. Even if TM threw the first punch, I think he was justified.

Following someone in general is not illegal, assuming you have a legal right to be in that place. To assume that person is a threat, is just that, an assumption, until a real threat is presented. To strike that person first is not defense.... that would be offense, which is assault. I think there are potential arguments justifying TM defending himself, assuming he was not the aggressor. If he was the aggressor though and presented a threat to GZ's life, he made a bad and immature decision to beat on the wrong guy and paid for it with his life.

Also, please make sure you are paying attention to the facts and not the stories. TM was not the cute kid in the photographs.. more like 6' tall 150+ lbs athletic. GZ is also not the tub-o-lard from his booking photo from years ago. He had lost some of that weight and is around 5'10". Not that I think size changes the justification, but since you do, don't be mislead.

So then based your own words, you agree that GZ was wrong to assume that TM was a threat while he was walking along minding his own business, looking around?

I teach MY kids that if someone is in a vehicle and is creeping up along beside them or behind them or pulls in front of them that they are to be very cautious and/or they are to run. WTH is the difference here? Obviously TM FELT threatened or unsafe since he mentioned being followed to his gf on the phone. So am I wrong in telling my kids that they are NOT to feel threatened by a creeper or someone watching them for more than a minute or two?

You don't know wth I have read or haven't read as far as this situation goes. I NEVER said he was "the cute kid in the photographs". But he wasn't some horrible looking kid either, nor did he look as threatening as you want us to feel that he is. 150 lbs is a lot different than 200lbs or 230lbs. I am NOT mislead on anything when it comes to this, who is making the ASSumptions now?

TM had just as much right to walking on that sidewalk and in that neighborhood as GZ.

You are proving my point. You teach your kids to run or seek safety. Not to attack. Most people teach their kids that you get away if you can and you fight back if you have to. I'm saying if TM attacked first, then the consequence was his own doing. If GZ started the physical altercation or done something illegale and had been shot (assuming the other person had a right to be there and was legally carrying a concealed weapon) I'd probably agree that was just as well.

I don't dispute TM's right to be there, and never have.

And as proven above... you are still mislead about the size comparison of the two individuals. "Horrible looking" is subjective... but in the most recent photos he posted online he doesn't appear as innocent as the original photos suggest.

Oops, did I leave out the part where I have told my kids that if someone does come too close to them or puts a hand on them or threatens them physically that they ARE to kick, scream, bite, pull, hit, punch, and do whatever is physically necessary to get away? I don't care if they are 5 or 15. They are to do whatever it takes. Going for the balls or the eyeballs first. They have also been given permission to fight back if someone starts a fight with them. I am one of the people who DO NOT believe that TM came up behind GZ and "confronted" him. I DO however believe that GZ caught up to him and TM asked him something along the lines of "Wtf are you following me?" Maybe TM felt like he couldn't get away...he had thought he lost GZ at one point. Then the jerk found him again. So since he couldn't get away...what is he left to do?

I have pics of me as a teenager flipping the bird to a friend with the camera, so I am not innocent? lmao. I am glad to know that that is something that means someone is an angel or not or innocent or not or worthy of being stereotyped.

Edited May 17, 2012 by NeverQuietHere

orangecrush · May 17, 2012

WTF does some kid flipping the bird in some pictures have to do with him being shot down like a dog by some fool who had no knowledge of those pictures, his school records, or anything else?

I have flipped a bird (I may have done it yesterday). Shockingly enough, I have no criminal record. Not even a deferred prosecution for attacking a police officer...

orangecrush · May 17, 2012

Old George Zimmerman Myspace page has disparaging remarks about Mexicans.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2012-05-02/news/os-george-zimmerman-myspace-trayvon-20120502_1_myspace-mexicans-new-photos

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/05/02/old-george-zimmerman-myspace-page-surfaces/

Edited May 17, 2012 by orangecrush

orangecrush · May 17, 2012

Trayvon Martin Autopsy: Evidence of pot in system

http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20120517/APN/1205170963

orangecrush · May 17, 2012

Police: Zimmerman's Encounter With Martin "Avoidable"

http://www.digtriad.com/news/national/article/229019/175/Police-Zimmermans-Encounter-With-Martin-Avoidable

The deadly encounter between George Zimmerman and Trayvon Martin was "ultimately avoidable" if Zimmerman had "remained in his vehicle and awaited the arrival of law enforcement," according to a Sanford police officer's report, the Orlando Sentinel says.

http://openchannel.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/05/17/11748468-court-docs-trayvon-martin-shooting-ultimately-avoidable-by-zimmerman?lite

But another police report indicated that Zimmerman had called Sanford police on at least four previous occasions while residing in the Retreat at Twin Lakes gated community in Sanford, and in each case the “suspicious person” was a black male.

“Investigation reveals that on Aug. 4, Aug. 5 and Oct. 6, 2001, and on Feb. 2, 2012, George Zimmerman reported suspicious persons – all young black males – in the Retreat neighborhood to Sanford Police Department,” it said. “According to records checks, all of Zimmerman’s suspicious persons calls while residing in the Retreat neighborhood have identified black males as the subjects.”

And a third police report indicated that Sanford police thought Zimmerman was at fault, even though they let him go after questioning him.

"Investigation reveals that Martin was in fact running generally in the direction of where he was staying as a guest in the neighborhood," it said.

Edited May 17, 2012 by orangecrush

Bad Doctor Frost · May 17, 2012

Trayvon Martin Autopsy: Evidence of pot in system

http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20120517/APN/1205170963

I don't even know why this made the news. Wait, yes I do. Sensationalists.

Anyway, a 17 year old, who smoked the MJ. Shocking.

I have news for you, parents. Chances are, your perfect little angel teenager who could do no wrong, has done weed. This is not any more news than if someone had corn for dinner.

road2freedom · May 17, 2012

WTF does some kid flipping the bird in some pictures have to do with him being shot down like a dog by some fool who had no knowledge of those pictures, his school records, or anything else?

Haha... shot like a dog. There you go assuming again and adding sensationalism. If he attacked first, then yes he was shot like a raging pit bull.

orangecrush · May 17, 2012

Trayvon Martin Case Shadowed by Series of Police Missteps

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/17/us/trayvon-martin-case-shadowed-by-police-missteps.html?_r=1&smid=tw-nytimes&pagewanted=all

road2freedom · May 17, 2012

Trayvon Martin Autopsy: Evidence of pot in system

http://www.heraldtri.../APN/1205170963

I don't even know why this made the news. Wait, yes I do. Sensationalists.

Anyway, a 17 year old, who smoked the MJ. Shocking.

I have news for you, parents. Chances are, your perfect little angel teenager who could do no wrong, has done weed. This is not any more news than if someone had corn for dinner.

That could be used to argue impaired judgement and to discredit (its still illegal). You are right though, lots of kids try pot. Not many of them get into physical altercations with adults and end up shot though. I'd say this one is a bit more unique.

road2freedom · May 17, 2012

Fallon, no worries. just had to tease ya.

Again there are a lot if ifs, and those circumstances belong to a lot of different individuals. However, following him on property where he had a right to be is not criminal. If Martin hit him first and was beating him on the ground I don't give a damn about what non-criminal matters led to up to it, it would make it Martin's own fault he was shot. If that's not what happened I would believe differently. I am open-minded enough to realize we don't know though.

Well, that's just stupid.

You wouldn't think so if you were being assaulted.

No, it IS stupid, being assaulted or not. TM knew some creep was following him and I don't see how anyone could NOT feel threatened by that. Plus, he was smaller than GZ. First Creep was following him in the truck and then on foot. I would be defensive, too. Even if TM threw the first punch, I think he was justified.

Following someone in general is not illegal, assuming you have a legal right to be in that place. To assume that person is a threat, is just that, an assumption, until a real threat is presented. To strike that person first is not defense.... that would be offense, which is assault. I think there are potential arguments justifying TM defending himself, assuming he was not the aggressor. If he was the aggressor though and presented a threat to GZ's life, he made a bad and immature decision to beat on the wrong guy and paid for it with his life.

Also, please make sure you are paying attention to the facts and not the stories. TM was not the cute kid in the photographs.. more like 6' tall 150+ lbs athletic. GZ is also not the tub-o-lard from his booking photo from years ago. He had lost some of that weight and is around 5'10". Not that I think size changes the justification, but since you do, don't be mislead.

So then based your own words, you agree that GZ was wrong to assume that TM was a threat while he was walking along minding his own business, looking around?

I teach MY kids that if someone is in a vehicle and is creeping up along beside them or behind them or pulls in front of them that they are to be very cautious and/or they are to run. WTH is the difference here? Obviously TM FELT threatened or unsafe since he mentioned being followed to his gf on the phone. So am I wrong in telling my kids that they are NOT to feel threatened by a creeper or someone watching them for more than a minute or two?

You don't know wth I have read or haven't read as far as this situation goes. I NEVER said he was "the cute kid in the photographs". But he wasn't some horrible looking kid either, nor did he look as threatening as you want us to feel that he is. 150 lbs is a lot different than 200lbs or 230lbs. I am NOT mislead on anything when it comes to this, who is making the ASSumptions now?

TM had just as much right to walking on that sidewalk and in that neighborhood as GZ.

You are proving my point. You teach your kids to run or seek safety. Not to attack. Most people teach their kids that you get away if you can and you fight back if you have to. I'm saying if TM attacked first, then the consequence was his own doing. If GZ started the physical altercation or done something illegale and had been shot (assuming the other person had a right to be there and was legally carrying a concealed weapon) I'd probably agree that was just as well.

I don't dispute TM's right to be there, and never have.

And as proven above... you are still mislead about the size comparison of the two individuals. "Horrible looking" is subjective... but in the most recent photos he posted online he doesn't appear as innocent as the original photos suggest.

Oops, did I leave out the part where I have told my kids that if someone does come too close to them or puts a hand on them or threatens them physically that they ARE to kick, scream, bite, pull, hit, punch, and do whatever is physically necessary to get away? I don't care if they are 5 or 15. They are to do whatever it takes. Going for the balls or the eyeballs first. They have also been given permission to fight back if someone starts a fight with them. I am one of the people who DO NOT believe that TM came up behind GZ and "confronted" him. I DO however believe that GZ caught up to him and TM asked him something along the lines of "Wtf are you following me?" Maybe TM felt like he couldn't get away...he had thought he lost GZ at one point. Then the jerk found him again. So since he couldn't get away...what is he left to do?

I have pics of me as a teenager flipping the bird to a friend with the camera, so I am not innocent? lmao. I am glad to know that that is something that means someone is an angel or not or innocent or not or worthy of being stereotyped.

Again.. your lesson is to do what it takes to fight someone off and get away. Not to jump on top and pummel someone and bash their head it. You are making this too easy on me.

Bad Doctor Frost · May 17, 2012

Trayvon Martin Autopsy: Evidence of pot in system

http://www.heraldtri.../APN/1205170963

I don't even know why this made the news. Wait, yes I do. Sensationalists.

Anyway, a 17 year old, who smoked the MJ. Shocking.

I have news for you, parents. Chances are, your perfect little angel teenager who could do no wrong, has done weed. This is not any more news than if someone had corn for dinner.

That could be used to argue impaired judgement and to discredit (its still illegal). You are right though, lots of kids try pot. Not many of them get into physical altercations with adults and end up shot though. I'd say this one is a bit more unique.

See, that still goes back to the whole issue of Zimmerman not staying in his car. For starters, I have a hard time believing TM started the fight...or whatever it was. Zimmerman had a record and was well-known for being over zealous. Zimmerman has a temper. This time it went too far and an innocent teenager is dead. I don't care that he was black, or that Zimmerman was hispanic. That's not the issue, at least to me it isn't. An innocent teenager is dead.

NeverQuietHere · May 17, 2012

My point is that TM had EVERY right to punch GZ since it is pretty obvious he wasn't the one shadowing GZ. Did you send GZ some money for his defense fund?

TM was near his home and ON THE PHONE WITH HIS gf. Not playing hide and seek. He was trying to get to his house, not to fight with GZ or to "jump" him. I wouldn't put it past GZ to have shown TM that the gun was on him. Again, this guy LIKES altercations. HE LIKES TO CHASE PEOPLE DOWN.

ETA: He shot an unarmed kid. At some point he had to have seen the Tea in his hand or the skittles and realized that it was nothing suspicious.He deserved to have 2 black eyes and a broken nose. Do you think that GZ would have put up with someone following him and asking what he was doing in that neighborhood? Please. He thought he was a bad flowers and couldn't be touched because as he has stated, he has gotten away with it before. How convenient that he only had to do anger management after assaulting an undercover cop.

Edited May 17, 2012 by NeverQuietHere

Fataliya · May 17, 2012

Trayvon Martin Autopsy: Evidence of pot in system

http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20120517/APN/1205170963

I don't even know why this made the news. Wait, yes I do. Sensationalists.

Anyway, a 17 year old, who smoked the MJ. Shocking.

I have news for you, parents. Chances are, your perfect little angel teenager who could do no wrong, has done weed. This is not any more news than if someone had corn for dinner.

Pot takes, what 30 days to leave your system? So Trayvon was allegedly high in the last 30 days. Zimmy was on RX meds, which, judging by the commercials, have way more harmful side effects.

I smoked lots of weed when I was younger. Was I supposed to be shot and killed?

If Zimmy had stayed his punk flowers in his vehicle, none of this would have happened. All this other crap is just nonsense to me. Threat, stand your ground. Zimmy was the threat for following Trayvon. Zimmy was the threat for approaching that child. Trayvon had a right to stand his ground. Zimmy started the whole ball rolling.

blackberry74 · May 17, 2012

WTF does some kid flipping the bird in some pictures have to do with him being shot down like a dog by some fool who had no knowledge of those pictures, his school records, or anything else?

Haha... shot like a dog. There you go assuming again and adding sensationalism. If he attacked first, then yes he was shot like a raging pit bull.

Uh huh...and there you go again failing to answer a question that has been posed to you and being obtuse. I'm shocked.

I'd love to know what you guys would do if somebody followed you first in their car and then on foot. Invite them in to play Yahtzee and sip chai tea?

Edited May 17, 2012 by blackberry74

Fataliya · May 17, 2012

WTF does some kid flipping the bird in some pictures have to do with him being shot down like a dog by some fool who had no knowledge of those pictures, his school records, or anything else?

Haha... shot like a dog. There you go assuming again and adding sensationalism. If he attacked first, then yes he was shot like a raging pit bull.

Uh huh...and there you go again failing to answer a question that has been posed to you and being obtuse. I'm shocked.

I'd love to know what you guys would do if somebody followed you first in their car and then on foot. Invite them in to play Yahtzee and sip chai tea?

I'd run, and if caught and/or approached, I'd fight for my life, or die trying.

blackberry74 · May 17, 2012

Fataliya, hush up. Nobody needs your common sense around here.

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